Removing front seats

[johnbendik]

Am I right in assuming that I have to unbolt the seat tracks from the floor to remove a front seat?  That's the impression I get from reading the seat-related topics here, but maybe I'm misinterpreting things...

My driver's seat skews to the left, and I want to see if it's got a spring or two broken or disconnected.

Thanks,
John

[profeagle]

Yes that is right, look for the rectangle U shaped washers on bottom, four per seat, 9/16" socket. - if I remember right 

Happy Eagle-ing   

[profeagle]

Yes that is right, look for the rectangle U shaped washers on bottom, four per seat, 9/16" socket. - if I remember right 

Happy Eagle-ing   

My bad, you need a 1/2" deep socket, plus extension & ratchet. I just went out and checked mine to be sure. 

[eaglefreek]

Yes, you have to crawl under the car and do it from underneath.

[amcfool1]

hi yes you have to unbolt the whole seat from under the car. 5 bolts per seat. to get to one bolt on the drivers seat, the t case skidplate needs to come off, no big deal really. If your seat skews, the track is probably worn, and or may have lost a ball bearing. If you find a small steel ball rolling around under there, don't throw it out! it can be put back in the track.  Taking the drivers seat out on the drivers side is a major pain, steering wheel in the way. best to pull both seats, and take drivers seat out through the passenger side, extra work, i know, but it gives you a chance to scope things out and lube the tracks.

[johnbendik]

Thanks to all for your quick replies.  You probably saved me some futile knuckle-busting trying to just remove the seats from the tracks.

Re-doing the front seats will be this week's project.  I got some very nice looking seat covers from Seat Covers Unlimited. I'm going to take 'em out first  and see if I can spruce up the springs, etc., before I put the covers on.

John

[captspillane]

I rarely unbolt them from underneath. It has always been faster to unbolt the four nuts that hold the seat to the tracks, especially when I don't want to get greasy reaching above the transmission from underneath right before going back up to work in the interior. Just mind the spring going from the track to the seat and use the seat to stretch the spring into place on the way back in, its not too bad. It is especially easy with the narrow body SX4 seats.

[johnbendik]

I have to admit that I'm kinda stuck on this one.  I tried Captspillane's method, but I could neither see nor touch the bolts holding the seat to the track on my '84 wagon.  I have thick hands and fingers, and not a lot of flexibility, so maybe that's why.

I also looked into just removing the tracks, as others have suggested.  3 of the 4 nuts for the driver-side seats are easily accessible, but the right-front nut is located directly above the transfer case (on my 5-speed wagon) .  I couldn't get a socket on it.  I think I might be able to remove it with a ratcheting box wrench, but I don't think I could ever get it and the backing plate back on when I was finished.  I can just barely touch the nut with the tip of my finger, and even that took some serious contortions.  I can't see that I could spin the nut back on, while holding the backing plate in place.

How did you guys do this?  Is maybe the nut not blocked on automatic transmission cars?

Thanks,
John

[amcfool1]

hi John  there are five bolts (studs actually) on an Eagle seat. 3 singles and a pair. the one above the t case is not as bad as it looks, but you HAVE to remove transfer case shield, five bolts of its own.  I think 5/8," this shield is easily removed..gravity!!, a little harder to put back, basically 'cause its heavy, get a friend to help, or lift with jack. With the shield out of the way,  you can access that last nut relatively easily, use a 1/2" deep socket, and a couple of extensions now you can also get your hand in there to put it back, to get nut started on stud, and if you just can't get it with your fingers, try a 1/4" drive palm ratchet. Also in this case, the "wobbler" extensions come in very handy. I just put my seat back last week, and I ain't getting any younger myself! good luck! gz

[Nightpath]

I've been debating tapping the studs out, threading a bolt in from the bottom and using a thin nut on the top between the rail and floor to hold the bolt in, then bolting the seat down. No more having to slink underneath to unbolt it.

[mudkicker715]

Pretty sure that long term the pressure points being smaller, will fail.

[amcfool1]

hi you can't really tap the studs out, they are welded to the tracks. that being said, I had a couple snap off due to rust, and had to grind/drill the seat channel mounting points for a hole. then you can use a regular bolt/nut. this actually makes things more difficult, as you now have to have a wrench both top and bottom for removal. has held up ok over the years though. btw I  have the "big" front seats, not buckets, and my car is automatic trans. front right bolt is still above tcase.  thanks gz

[johnbendik]

I'm posting this to thank everyone who told me (basically) to just suck it up and remove the bolt (the one hidden by the transfer case).

I was able to remove it fairly easily, by using a 'wobble extension' on my ratchet as amcfool1 suggested.  Replacing it (with the backing plate) was much tougher, but I eventually got it done by using rubber cement to temporarily glue the backing plate to the nut.  I was then able to balance the whole thing on the end of my ratchet, snake it up to the stud using the wobble extension, catch it on the stud and start tightening.  Once the backing plate got within range of the bottom of the car, it caught on it with enough friction to break the rubber cement bond to the nut and freeze into position (as I'd hoped it would), and I was able to tighten the nut down properly.  Only took about an hour (and sacrificing the requisite amount of knuckle blood to the car repair gods, of course).

I was glad I didn't give up on it.  When I got the seat out, I discovered that 3 of the 4 front-to-back springs had long ago broken where they fasten to the back of the seat bottom frame.  Someone before me had tried to repair each broken spring with twine, believe it or not!  The twine had long since broken and unraveled, hence the sagging seat.  I couldn't find an easy source for replacement springs, so I used small hose clamps to bind each broken spring together.  I then used cable ties to cross-connect each spring to its neighbor at 7 or 8 places, just to tighten the whole seat bottom:


I'm not exactly proud of this rig, but I'm not too ashamed of it, either...

The two techniques together seemed to take most of the sag out of the seat.  I no longer feel like I'm leaning uphill to reach the steering wheel.

Thanks again to everyone for your tips and encouragement.

John Bendiksen

[amcfool1]

hi john glad it worked out for you, looks like a good fix! GZ

[captspillane]

Unless I'm removing the rug I always leave the tracks behind. There is only four nuts holding the seat to the tracks. They are pretty easy to get at from underneath once you've done a couple. Its easy to stretch the spring on the side back when reinstalling them. On the narrow seats I pop the cushions off first and get to the four nuts from above through the frame. I always avoid getting greased up under the car going for the one bolts above the transmission when I'm working on interior stuff.