torque converter or tranny?

[SleepsUnderCars]

my 80 Spirit has a problem. It seems to have lost 3rd gear. It runs around fine if I shift it into 2, but if it is in drive it has nothing after shifting up from second. Like it is in neutral. I know the 80 Spirits came with both lockup and non-lockup TC, could this just be a bad lockup converter?
is there any way to identify which converter without pulling the tranny?

[BenM]

You may be able to read printing on the torque converter if you take the inspection cover off, but I don't recall any external differences.

According to my 76 TSM, third gear is both the front and rear clutches engaged. The rear controls all gears, but the front is only ever applied in 3rd and Reverse.  I don't see any mentions of 3rd gear only not working. How's your reverse?

[SleepsUnderCars]

reverse is fine. I can back up all day long. That's why I am thinking a lockup TC that is failing to lock

[eaglebeek]

The lockup doesn't engage until after the transmission has shifted to 3rd gear and the car is moving forward at around 35 mph (depending on final drive ratio). I doubt the torque converter is the cause.

I'm thinking one of the clutches/bands has failed. The other consideration is a hydraulic fault. Have you noticed if the shift quality or speed at which shifts occur have changed since your malfunction showed up?

I can do some research and come up with a better answer tomorrow (Thursday). Meanwhile, if someone else has an answer please post up!

[mudkicker715]

You may be able to read printing on the torque converter if you take the inspection cover off, but I don't recall any external differences.

According to my 76 TSM, third gear is both the front and rear clutches engaged. The rear controls all gears, but the front is only ever applied in 3rd and Reverse.  I don't see any mentions of 3rd gear only not working. How's your reverse?

There is numbers however they are stamped on the inside. I cannot tell if I ever had a lockup by driving them. I know by tearing them apart I I had some.

Here comes the stupid answer. My 82 concord is in neutral from park to drive till I go half go to second than back to drive at takeoff. I need to adjust it.

Whats my response to your problem. He[% if I know not even sure if I have a lockup yet. Just saying check linkage.

Anyone that knows my responses, knows I only typy say one sentence. So read carefully.

[DaemonForce]

It's time for an overhaul kit.

[SleepsUnderCars]

yeah, I am figuring it's time to learn how to rebuild one.

[SleepsUnderCars]

it's not the linkage. Works fine in 'D' until it's time to shift into 3rd. Then it's nothing until I slow down enough to hit the downshift into 2nd.

[carnuck]

Sounds like the passing gear linkage is jammed down. Or the high forward clutches are burnt out. Not the converter or it wouldn't go anywhere.

It's up to you if you want to try this, but I have a number of times in the past and it revived most of the transmissions I did it to. A can of STP engine oil treatment in the trans. Drive it around a bit with that in there before heading for highway speeds so it gets good and warmed up and mixes in. Then cruise up to 35ish and back off the gas, put it in drive and coast about 10 seconds before trying the gas.

[SleepsUnderCars]

I'll try anythin at this point. What have I got to lose? Worst case I will be rebuilding....

[HappyPappy]

Might try SEA FOAM to, I've used it in engines already with great luck. 904 aren't hard to rebuild, helps if you have the right tools. Good luck

[SleepsUnderCars]

I tried seafom for transmission last night. No help. Have done a lot of reading on the net about Torqueflites, gonna have to rebuild.
have to get something else on the road first as I need transportation to work.

[shanebo]

If you do rebuild I would love to see pictures...I got my transmission sitting on an oil drum in my garage with exactly the same issue.

[AMCKen]

Also check that the linkage between the transmission and the throttle is set up correctly. A mis-adjusted kick
down can cause weird problems.

[DaemonForce]

It's not the kickdown linkage. It's a fault within the transmission itself. What he's experiencing is a normal shift from 1st to 2nd and it shifts into 3rd making you believe that this would be the kickdown linkage at fault. If this were the case, it wouldn't shift out of 2nd. Problem is, instead of going into 3rd it behaves as if it went straight into neutral and keeps this behavior until the vehicle slows enough to where it kicks down to 2nd again. This is clearly a fault somewhere between the torque converter and tail housing. I suspect the front clutches to be burned out but it's also possible that there are other faults as well. An overhaul will tell.

I suggest very thorough examination. Deep cavity search. Assume nothing.