Odd Electrical Issue

[recomer]

I have an one-wire on another car that I'm going to pull out when I put it back on the road. I didn't know at the time what the difference was, but I do now. I have also learned that the stamp on the case is the factory marking. On a rebuild it could be anything as they mix-and-match cases, but I'd expect the receipt is correct.

Here is a good listing of part numbers for alts

in my search, I looked at the DelcoRemy (both new and rebuilt) and thought about going with one of thiers, but couldnt find anyone local that sold them. I decided not to go with any of the auto parts stores (NAPA, Advance, Pepboys, etc) as they were all house brands and I couldnt get much info on how they rebuilt and where they were rebuilt.  So I started seaching online for NEW alternators and read every review I could find. Since my last rebuilt NAPA was 98.00, it wasnt much of a stretch to get a new for the same price. PowerMasters had lots of good reviews so I went that way. Hopefully I wont have to test out thier warranty process.

[recomer]

Alternator arrived today, installed and cars much happier. Ammeter is pointing where its supposed to again. I got was The PowerMaster 12si, 100 Amp, P/N 7294. Perfect fit and everything lined up.

[Jurjen]

Good job, the original alternator is not really powerfull enough when everything is on.

[AMC lifer]

I went through 3 alternators (reman) in an S10 from Napa before I got a good one

Given the length of time I have a car (my recently departed Eagle - 18 years), it's worth the extra money to buy a lifetime alternator. Even if you get bad ones, at least the only thing you are out of is the time to replace it yourself.

[recomer]

Is there any other battery group size besides 56 that anyones squeezed into thier Eagle? Mines not holding a charge and am taking it in to get replaced tomorrow. Unfortunately Sears only has one group 56 battery and its not a diehard. Wanted to see if I had any options.

Thanks,

[recomer]

Got a new battery and still having issues. As I just installed new alternator too, I emailed the following to the manufacture of the alternator:

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I just recently purchased a Power Master 7294 100A alternator through Summit Racing. It's installed on my 1983 AMC Eagle with a 4.2L (258 CI) engine. Car and engine is stock. Reason I went for the larger alternator is cost was close enough to cost of a NEW OEM alternator and the reviews I've read on your products on the Jeep web sites have been really good.

Here's my issue. I was having issues lately with battery not charging. Its a sears battery, I took it to them and after running load test and charging system tests, the battery has a weak cell and the alternator was only putting out slightly over 12 volts. So, I needed both new alternator and battery. I have both now. Watching the volt gage on the dash, previous to this issue, it stayed in between the too low and too high red areas of the meter. When the problem started, it stays in the too low area and this was confirmed by sears. Now, with the new alternator and battery, I still have that issue. I just checked the battery with a multimeter and it read 12.4 volts prior to starting and just slightly higher when engine was running. I checked the voltage at the alternator and it mirrored what I seen at the battery.

The proof of performance tag that was on the alternator when I received it says it was set at 14.7 volts (Dated 10-26-12 initialed by JG). What am I missing that is making this too low to keep charging the battery? Other symptoms I see are as follows:

- After driving the car for about 15 minutes the voltmeter on the dash creeps up to normal but immediately goes below the red zone if I turn on something electrical that have a higher current draw (wipers, lights, blinkers, etc.) Just having the radio on doesn't cause the issues.

- I was verifying alternator belt tightness and when I accidently touched the alternator pulley, I almost burned my finger. I dripped a little water on the pulley and it was hot enough to turn it to steam.

I looked over the wiring, for the charging circuit, I don't see anything broke, grounded, melted, etc. Solenoid and battery cables are new. What am I missing?
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Any suggestions?

[Jurjen]

I don't know if the Power Masters are also reman 12si aternators?
This means you could have a faulty one.

The wiring in the car may have almost shorted out somewhere, but then it should get hot somewhere too.
Do you have a multimeter that can do 20 to 50 Amps, you could put it in series with the one wire connection and check the Amps with no load (lamps, defroster, vent etc off), should be less than 5 Amps. Which size AWG does your one wire connection have? Is the engine ground cable OK?

Here you will find some background information:

http://bob_skelly.home.comcast.net/~bob_skelly/alternator_conversion/wiring_alternator1.html

[BenM]

While the car is running, and after charging the battery:

Check the alternator to battery, then check between both battery terminals and the fender for the voltage.

Probe the two connectors on the top of the alt. They are the sense and excite wires, and should be the same voltage as the rest of the system. See if that wire harness is hot. Both wires should show 12v with the ignition on, there is a resistor and the dash light in the excite wire, but they shouldn't show any significant voltage drop with no load.

After all that's done, you can always try to convert it to one-wire and see what happens. A 12v bulb between the excite terminal and the pos terminal on the alt, then a plain wire between the sense terminal and the pos terminal will bypass the stock harness (and might drain your battery overnight) but should provide 14v at the pos terminal on the alt.

I'm expecting a harness or ground issue right now since everything is new.

[recomer]

I don't know if the Power Masters are also reman 12si aternators?
This means you could have a faulty one.

The wiring in the car may have almost shorted out somewhere, but then it should get hot somewhere too.
Do you have a multimeter that can do 20 to 50 Amps, you could put it in series with the one wire connection and check the Amps with no load (lamps, defroster, vent etc off), should be less than 5 Amps. Which size AWG does your one wire connection have? Is the engine ground cable OK?

Here you will find some background information:

http://bob_skelly.home.comcast.net/~bob_skelly/alternator_conversion/wiring_alternator1.html

THanks for the comments. The powermaster is new, not remanufactured. I looked over all the wiring for the charging circuit and came across one half butt repair someone did. THey took a bunch of wires that were supposed to go to the hot side of the solenoid (Including the one from the Alternator) and wrapped them all together, soldered them to a piece of 10 guage wire and then connected that to the solenoid and wrapped the junction with electrical tape. Connection was solid so dont think thats the issue (going to fix that tomorrow). Engine ground cable is solid and I have a good ground there. I dont have a multimeter that'll go that high amp wise, but see what you're getting at. The wire from the alternator the factory wire. 10 guage maybe?

[recomer]

While the car is running, and after charging the battery:

Check the alternator to battery, then check between both battery terminals and the fender for the voltage.

Probe the two connectors on the top of the alt. They are the sense and excite wires, and should be the same voltage as the rest of the system. See if that wire harness is hot. Both wires should show 12v with the ignition on, there is a resistor and the dash light in the excite wire, but they shouldn't show any significant voltage drop with no load.

After all that's done, you can always try to convert it to one-wire and see what happens. A 12v bulb between the excite terminal and the pos terminal on the alt, then a plain wire between the sense terminal and the pos terminal will bypass the stock harness (and might drain your battery overnight) but should provide 14v at the pos terminal on the alt.

I'm expecting a harness or ground issue right now since everything is new.

Good ideas. I did check to see if there was a voltage drop from alternator to battery and it was abot .02 volts. Wires weren't hot. (see other post to Jurjen on what I did find) Both the sense and excite wires were slightly over 12 volts with ignition on. WIth the powermaster, it'll do one wire operation. Thats something I didnt think of.  Thanks... stuff to try tomorrow.

[AMC lifer]

Is there any other battery group size besides 56 that anyones squeezed into thier Eagle? Mines not holding a charge and am taking it in to get replaced tomorrow. Unfortunately Sears only has one group 56 battery and its not a diehard. Wanted to see if I had any options.

Thanks,

I did squeeze in a large battery in my Eagle. Unfortunately, I do not have the car anymore to be able to tell you what size it was. I do know that depending on the battery brand, it was rated for 800 - 1000 CCA.

How I got the battery to fit was that I took out the battery tray& on the long side of the tray, cutthe corners & flattened the lip down. Just that 1/4" or so width of the battery made the difference. It fit snugly between the fender & the AC line. I also put some wood shims under the battery to help keep it away from the AC line. I drove it like that for many years & replaced batteries only after their 72 month warranty was up & had no problems. If you wanted, you could probably fashion a strap to hold the battery to the fender away from the AC line.

[SpreadEagle]

Is there any other battery group size besides 56 that anyones squeezed into thier Eagle? Mines not holding a charge and am taking it in to get replaced tomorrow. Unfortunately Sears only has one group 56 battery and its not a diehard. Wanted to see if I had any options.

Thanks,

I did squeeze in a large battery in my Eagle. Unfortunately, I do not have the car anymore to be able to tell you what size it was. I do know that depending on the battery brand, it was rated for 800 - 1000 CCA.

How I got the battery to fit was that I took out the battery tray& on the long side of the tray, cutthe corners & flattened the lip down. Just that 1/4" or so width of the battery made the difference. It fit snugly between the fender & the AC line. I also put some wood shims under the battery to help keep it away from the AC line. I drove it like that for many years & replaced batteries only after their 72 month warranty was up & had no problems. If you wanted, you could probably fashion a strap to hold the battery to the fender away from the AC line.

Been thinking about a simular modification to my Eagle, difference being I was thinking I'm hacking into the radiatorandcrearing a boxed area that will fit a group 34/78 battery. Tight fit but measures to a secure fit.

[Jurjen]

I think I have a group 34 Optima Red Top in there.
Very reliable, fits just fine, 50Ah and 815CCA.
Will also start after a long period of not using the Eagle.

[recomer]

Well, after a couple weeks of this I kinda feel stupid. Votlage is back to normal again and while the battery was one of the issues (BTW, the battery that was in my car was a group 55 and its since been replaced with a group 56 vice warranty with Sears).

I called a friend of mine on Sunday and we talked for about 30-45 minutes about the voltage issues and he agreed I'd done everything possible and it had to be a faulty alternator. He told me to verify by starting car and removing hot lead from Battery. If car died, it would confirm.  So I tried, and guess what? Car stayed running. The other word of advice he gave was start from the beginning and check everything again. I checked Belt Tightness and while it seemed tight enough, I went ahead and loosened the alternator to tighten it again. I'll be :water reservoir:, the voltage went up to 14.5 volts when I started it. It looks like thats all it was. Battery Meter Guage is back in the middle again. So strange that belt was tight (no squeeling or anything) yet that appears to be the fix for this. I would have beat my head against the car last night but decided not to as I didnt want to knock anything else loose.

[carnuck]

That actually sounds like there was corrosion between the alt and mounting, where moving it made the voltage jump up. Bad ground from the body to the motor will have this effect too.