I got this about a year ago, figured I might as well get around to posting it
Couple pictures from the craigslist ad:
(http://i.imgur.com/tzEp3.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/JdK34.jpg)
Don't think I got any pictures under the hood before messing with a few things but here it is with the HEI distributor and the plastic valve cover off because it was leaking oil
(http://i.imgur.com/pD6j6.jpg)
Interior
(http://i.imgur.com/cTBAV.jpg)
Drag racing lol
(http://i.imgur.com/vVnUx.jpg)
New valve cover which still has a minor oil leak because of the near impossible to get to bolt in the back
(http://i.imgur.com/0VbvS.jpg)
Weber 38
(http://i.imgur.com/RqXUd.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/RRWuX.jpg)
That's all the pictures I have for now, planning on getting the clifford header/intake when I get some extra money unless someone knows of something that would work better and/or is cheaper
i got a jeep header shipped to my house for just over $100. minor exaust fabricating was needed to get around the axel bracket after the collector. that rear bolt with the right combo of tools is super easy. somthing like socket extension u joint extension ratchet.
anyway nice looker
I did the old -drill a hole down through the firewall lip right above the bolt and use a 1/4" ratchet and longer extension down to it, worked like a charm.
Quote from: 68AMXGOPAC on October 29, 2012, 09:10:17 AM
I did the old -drill a hole down through the firewall lip right above the bolt and use a 1/4" ratchet and longer extension down to it, worked like a charm.
I might have to try this, I've tried with an extension and swivel socket adapter before but just when it starts to get tight, the socket starts trying to round the bolt head
So I accidentally made a hole in the oil pan this morning, tire was flat and needed to jack it up for it to hold air and it fell off the jack
Is removing the oil pan or the entire motor easier? The Chilton book actually says that removing the motor is easier in most cases
i would remove the motor
Decided to go the route of pulling the motor
Got the radiator, fan shroud, and most of the wiring and hoses off/out of the way today, are there any upgrades or things I should check while i have it out? I don't really want to completely tear down the motor but something like a new cam/lifters might be nice to do while the motor is already out
Quote from: nolang on November 03, 2012, 10:31:56 PM
Decided to go the route of pulling the motor
Got the radiator, fan shroud, and most of the wiring and hoses off/out of the way today, are there any upgrades or things I should check while i have it out? I don't really want to completely tear down the motor but something like a new cam/lifters might be nice to do while the motor is already out
...and a new rear crank seal... :eagle:
How much extra valve clearance is there to use? I don't really want to jump on buying a new cam kit and then afterwards learn that it won't work without some extra work/money
Currently looking at one of these two:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k68-200-4/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k68-200-4/)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k68-201-4/ (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-k68-201-4/)
Either of those should work fine. I wouldn't use the Comp Cams springs though. I would go with some stock replacement springs. Many say that the Comp Cam springs are too stiff a rate and prematurely wipe out the cam. I've got a higher lift cam than the ones that you posted with stock replacement springs and no problems.
I've got it to the point where I should just have to unbolt the transmission and pull it out but I'm not sure where to bolt the chain to, any suggestions?
Finally got the motor out, getting to the transmission bolts is not an easy task
(http://i.imgur.com/d993j.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/yz4km.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/wbSbA.jpg)
Oil pan is patched and back on the motor, now for the fun of putting the motor back in
(http://i.imgur.com/TSgRm.jpg)
Got the motor back in about a week ago and have most stuff reattached, pretty much just the torque converter, exhaust, radiator/fan and some miscellaneous wires and hoses to do
Of course after it took me most of a day to remove the bolts to the transmission, it only took me ~30 minutes to put them back in >:( Also found out that the vacuum line to my front axle is just plugged off with a screw so hopefully i'll have that fixed by the time it's running again
So the car was running yesterday, just a couple minor leaks that needed fixed otherwise it seems to be running as good as before if not a little better, still need to get a vacuum hose for the front axle but that should be fairly easy, at least I hope it is ;D
Eggcellent. :eaglebig:
Finally decided to order a cam last night after i saw this one on ebay for $80 (new but unsealed box) http://www.summitracing.com/parts/crn-753901 (http://www.summitracing.com/parts/crn-753901)
Also got the springs that are suggested to go with it for $32 and the lifters for about the normal price
Apparently the timing sprockets are at least partially nylon? Ordered a timing set either way since i'll be messing around with stuff down there anyway, should hopefully be able to get to putting the new cam and everything in within a couple of weeks
Are clifford headers pretty much the only option for the 4.2 head?
What times did you run with your eagle at the drag strip
The first time i took it out when it only had the hei distributor and everything else was stock, it ran 19.60's :rotfl:
After putting the weber 38 on, it ran a solid second faster
Started taking everything apart to install the new cam today, unless i'm forgetting something then there's pretty much just the head, harmonic balancer, and timing cover left to go
Picture of all the goodies:
(http://i.imgur.com/vXQW0ki.jpg)
Be sure to take and post lots of pictures.
I am enjoying seeing your progress.
What did you eventually hook the chains to when removing the engine? Any other pictures to show how you did it?
Kevin
Medina, OH
One end of the chain went to the bracket with the belt tensioner on the front and the other went to one of the head studs connected by a piece of flatbar if i remember correctly, probably not ideal but it worked
All the pictures i've taken are in the thread so far, i'll try to take some more during this
Got the head pulled off and the back bolt on the driver side was covered in milky oil and the spark plug on the front cylinder is quite a bit cleaner than the rest
(http://i.imgur.com/84YjUiY.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/vVnLCDw.jpg)
The cam is out, should just be down to putting everything back together at this point, there was definitely a good amount of slack in the old timing chain, though i don't know if you can tell by looking at the picture
(http://i.imgur.com/dJPDGVn.jpg)
Wish AMC never used those nylon toothed timing chain
Fortunately the new comp timing set i got is all iron
Decided i'd clean up the timing cover today and paint it
All the grease and grime on the bubble wrap came off of the inside:
(http://i.imgur.com/eXtKPgt.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/iTT0let.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/O4ze5M8.jpg)
The color is apparently Chrysler Red but it looks more orange than red to me
Also put the new cam and lifters in, here's a picture of the cams next to each other though there's probably no visible difference other than the new one being a little cleaner
(http://i.imgur.com/Vn1C94y.jpg)
Planning on putting the new springs on the head tomorrow, maybe do the timing chain too
As is my luck, everything was going too smoothly so something had to go wrong, the old retainers are too small
Ordered the correct sized retainers and locks and some shims which should be here friday
Hopefully the eagle will be up and running again by the end of the weekend ;D
New timing set on:
(http://i.imgur.com/iqSDi1O.jpg)
Are you using springs from Comp Cams? I'd be wary, aftermarket 258/4.0L cams are know to wipe out lopes in less than 10k miles with too much spring pressure. I've got a Comp Cams camshaft and used stock replacement springs and have had zero issues in 25k miles.
Crane springs, summit shows the springs i have are 204 lbs/in and the comp springs suggested for the comp cam that's pretty close to the cam i have are 415 lbs/in
Too bad you couldn't access a 4.0L for parts. I'd slap on the timing cover and cam bolt (built in cam button)
sounds like fun keep us posted that is my plan for this year also is have the engine rebuilt it currently has 181K on it. How many miles did your engine have on it before you started the tear down?
I think it has about 126k miles
As it turns out, i'm using the stock springs after all, the retainers i bought made the installed height of the new springs 1.625 which is a bit short
Got all the major stuff done, just need to put in the radiator, fan, valve cover then connect random hoses and it should be ready to fire up ;D
Got it running today, needs some carb adjustment but otherwise it seems to run good
Does anyone know if the AMC V8 5/16 pedestal mount rocker arms are interchangeable with the straight six? Seems like the closest thing i can find for roller rockers are harland sharp and they're specified for the 4.0 and studs, not to mention $100 more than some of the rocker arms for the V8s
I was changing the jets monday night and somehow the needle completely vanished so hopefully the new needle and seat i ordered will be here tomorrow
Also figured i might as well use the new springs so i ordered what SHOULD be the right height of retainer, installed height with the wrong retainers was 1.625 and they were supposed to add .045, so i found some that are supposed to take away .030, should put me right at 1.700 which is the suggested height for the cam
Well back to the drawing board, apparently there was coil bind on the stock springs which wore pockets into at least one of the lifters, probably more and probably messed up the camshaft too
Also for what it's worth, my interpretation on the heights of those new retainers was wrong
Ordered the crower baja beast and one of crowers spring/lifters/retainers sets, hopefully everything will install at the right heights and i won't have any more issues :'(
Nice! That's the cam I wanted for my stroker.
Pulled the cam out today, as long as i get the new valves, rocker arms, and gaskets tomorrow i should be able to start reassembling it
I think the only thing that won't be new in the valve train will be the locks, which only have those few days that the old new cam was being used for on them
One of the lobes on the old cam
(http://i.imgur.com/RqgzZgb.jpg)
One of the old lifters, some were worse, some looked usable still if this were a post-apocalyptic world where lifters were hard to come by but since it's not, i won't use them :rotfl:
(http://i.imgur.com/8bcB353.jpg)
Head is put back together
(http://i.imgur.com/zPvVBND.jpg)
New one piece pushrods, chromoly and .020" thicker wall if i remember right, new on top, old on bottom
(http://i.imgur.com/MkBcYy5.jpg)
New cam and lifters
(http://i.imgur.com/oXSkWMP.jpg)
Also the new springs went on at 1.75 and for some reason the cam card only shows installed pressures, not heights but the installed closed pressure is specified at 100 lbs and at 1.75 it would be 94 lbs, close enough for me ;D
Got it running again today, only took the weekend instead of a weekend plus a few days like last time ;D
Somehow i always end up with exhaust leaks though, even on different cars >:(
I feel horrible. I didn't see the post where you got the Crower cam when I was telling you to use the stock springs. I only saw the post on the first page when you were looking at the Comp Cams camshafts that had less lift than the one I have. The Crower would have coil bind with the stock springs as you found out, unfortunately. I hope you don't punch me in the jaw if we we ever get together at an Eagle meet. :boxing:
Quote from: eaglefreek on March 17, 2013, 09:15:44 PM
I feel horrible. I didn't see the post where you got the Crower cam when I was telling you to use the stock springs. I only saw the post on the first page when you were looking at the Comp Cams camshafts that had less lift than the one I have. The Crower would have coil bind with the stock springs as you found out, unfortunately. I hope you don't punch me in the jaw if we we ever get together at an Eagle meet. :boxing:
It was actually the crane cam that the springs were binding with which is .456/.484 lift, there should have still been ~.080 before coil bind but apparently that wasn't the case, when i bought the car i was told the head and tranny had been rebuilt, maybe they put on different springs than stock ???
The crower cam is what's in now, with the matching spring/retainer/lifter set and new everything else in the valve train it seems to be running pretty good other than the exhaust leak ;D
Here's what my rear brakes looked like when i pulled them off about a week ago:
(http://i.imgur.com/fZhGPYu.jpg)
I took the eagle out to the dragstrip yesterday to see how much faster it would be with the new cam, unfortunately it was actually slower >:(
Maybe i just need to do some carb tuning but otherwise i'm not sure what would cause it to be slower than before
I changed the jets back to the smaller ones that i have and re-gapped the plugs to .040, one of the ground electrodes was off center a little bit too, not sure how much that affects things but there's much less visible exhaust now so i must've done something right :rotfl:
Also washed it and decided it was time for a new exterior picture to replace the craigslist ones:
(http://i.imgur.com/snLBRgT.jpg)
Eagle is looking very nice. And thanks for the detailed write up on your progress.
At some point in the near future, preferably before the rain starts to come back, i'd like the rebuild the motor on this thing but i got to thinking that if i'm going through the much work, i should try to add some performance as well
That led me to finding this: http://www.shop.505performance.com/product.sc;jsessionid=01E666637F7FFE1037A1AEA4D2BB71B6.m1plqscsfapp02?productId=287&categoryId=39 (http://www.shop.505performance.com/product.sc;jsessionid=01E666637F7FFE1037A1AEA4D2BB71B6.m1plqscsfapp02?productId=287&categoryId=39)
However, i'd rather not spend a fortune on it, is it at all possible to stroke the 4.2 for a reasonable price?
I suppose if that doesn't work out, i'll just do a rebuild and throw a 4.0 head on it
Definetly possible to stroke a motor for much less. i have done 2 now. they are crazy awesome. the 4.0 head thing is useless compared to a stroker. now this price really depends on the donor 4.0.
I was thinking more towards stroking the 4.2 if possible, i'd rather not deal with all the little changes/modifications that would go with putting a 4.0 in
The more i read though, the less likely this sounds, are there extra electronics that need hooked up with the 4.0? I'd rather avoid any extra sensors or anything like that if i can
Usually when someone says they are installing a 4.0, they mean they are taking the entire engine, serpantine accessories, and fuel injection with it. It is possible to just take the long block and put it where the 4.2 long block was, and vice versa. Here are some possible combinations:
1) If you put a 4.0L long block in place of a 4.2 long block you gain the better camshaft and head design and you get roughly 140 HP instead of 110 HP you had with the crummy 4.2L camshaft and head. You lose the mechanical fuel pump and must use an electric one. You have a valve cover that doesn't leak. You'll need some washers in the front of the crank to mount the old belt accessories. It is pretty much a bolt in, quick installation that leaves your engine compartment looking pretty much exactly the same afterward and the car running better.
2) If you put a 4.2L long block in place of a 4.0L long block, which I'm doing in a Jeep MJ Commanche right now, you lose a great deal of power and efficiency because of the poor head design and camshaft. In my case I'm also using a 4.0 head and camshaft with a 4.2L short block, so I actually gain a little bit of power because of the extra displacement. You can still use the fuel injection and everything else that used to be on the 4.0L. You need a cover plate where the mechanical fuel pump used to be. You need a specific year of bracket that doesn't need a boss missing on the passenger side. You need to cut a little bit off the front of the crank to fit the serpantine accessories.
3) If you put a 4.0L in with all the serpantine accessories, you get 190 HP. Carbs are initially very attractive because of how few components are present, but they are very tempermental and pathetically inefficient and unreliable. The extra time it takes to fuel inject gives you a die-hard reliable, efficient system that puts out 50 extra HP and requires little to no extra maintenance. It is alot to gain at the expense of a little bit of clutter in the engine compartment.
4) You can also mix and match components. Fuel injection manifolds can be used with V belt accessories. Serpantine accessories can be used with carb intake manifolds. All the problems that arise are easy solutions. For example, the MPI temp sensor conflicts with the Vbelt pulley with AC but Hesco sells a simple adaptor to move the sensore a few inches away. All of the possibilities are nearly bolt in installations with maybe a grinder cut here or a hole enlarged there.
5) If you make a stroker by combining putting a 4.2L crank into a 4.0L block, you get the best combination.
How much rewiring is there to do if you swap a 4.0 in? Will stock fuel injectors work?
If I go the 4.0 route, i'm thinking of going with a kit like this: http://www.cleggengine.com/jeep-4-0l-stage-2-stroker-kit-9-2-1c-r-4-5l-4-6l-4-7l-242-amc.html (http://www.cleggengine.com/jeep-4-0l-stage-2-stroker-kit-9-2-1c-r-4-5l-4-6l-4-7l-242-amc.html)
It would be nice to use the stuff out of the 4.2 to save some money but considering this is my daily driver, being able to machine and put together the 4.0 while still driving would be a plus, though if i went to fuel injection and didn't use anything out of the 4.2, i could probably come close to paying for the 4.0 and stroker kit with that, if I was to part it out anyway ;D
4.0L has more power than a 4.2L If your current 4.2L is in good shape, you can sell it afterwards. You need a 4.0L block and head to put it together. You CAN'T use this kit in a 4.2L because the cylinder walls aren't thick enough to bore it 160 thousands over. Your best bet is to find a '91 to '95 XJ to get everything you need for wiring. Get auto if you have auto or stick if you have a stick. My '87 Comanche has minor running glitches due to being a standard box on an auto trans.
Everything you need for wiring is under the hood except the transmission controller on automatics which is under the glovebox in the XJ (not weatherproof)
here is a swap that was in the eaglepedia
http://www.amceaglesden.com/~iowaeagl/guide/index.php?title=Joshpit%27s_4.0_Swap_Article (http://www.amceaglesden.com/~iowaeagl/guide/index.php?title=Joshpit%27s_4.0_Swap_Article)
I might still just go with a rebuild and the 4.0 head, the stroker idea is really tempting but sounds like a lot more work/money than i want to go through
Even with just a rebuild it would probably run 10x better than it does now, it just hasn't been quite right since that first cam got wiped from the stock valve springs, it idles and runs fine but almost seems like it might have less power than it did in stock form, plenty of blow-by too
Flatlander Racing makes a stroker kit for the 258. It's a little pricey, but you don't have to worry about finding a 4.0L and swapping out all the accessories. You can keep the carb if you want with the 4.0L head. http://www.flatlanderracing.com/strokeramc-258.html
I think I changed my mind again, i'll update the thread after I've actually bought/ordered something :rotfl: