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Author Topic: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise  (Read 17217 times)

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Offline Zoro

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Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« on: December 14, 2011, 12:22:45 PM »
Looked under the Eagle for the first time in awhile and found a rusty looking pipe that crosses over from the driver side to passenger side. Looks like at one point somebody patched it with a piece of heater hose.

Here's a few pictures, what do you guys think?





Also noticed the pipe that runs from the CAT forward just randomly ends.




What do you guys think?
84 Eagle Wagon aka 'Zoro II'
263,000 miles and counting!

Offline GRONK

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2011, 01:22:29 PM »
It's the pulse air feeder tube for your Cat.  yoink it!
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Offline Zoro

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #2 on: December 14, 2011, 01:52:39 PM »
It's the pulse air feeder tube for your Cat.  yoink it!

So not needed I take it? How do I cap it off?
84 Eagle Wagon aka 'Zoro II'
263,000 miles and counting!

Offline GRONK

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #3 on: December 14, 2011, 02:22:02 PM »
You can weld a bung over the open hole, pull the whole cat and add a delete pipe, or cap it with a copper plumbing bugg and some JB weld.  I have done all of the above.
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Offline craigp29690

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2011, 12:42:46 PM »
It's interesting that your pipe was wrapped with stuff too.  The line that runs from the manifold to the passenger side of the engine on mine was wrapped in some sort of rubber-like material as well. 
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1966 Rambler Classic Wagon              1981 MAZDA 626 (RWD)
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Offline BenM

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2011, 01:27:32 PM »
It's only important if you need emissions testing, otherwise cap it. I'd just roll down the end, it won't hurt anything, but right now it's an exhaust leak. It provides extra air to the cat so it works better when the engine runs rich.
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Offline Zoro

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2011, 04:24:33 PM »
I guess I'll get in there and plug it up. Thanks for the help!
84 Eagle Wagon aka 'Zoro II'
263,000 miles and counting!

Offline carnuck

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #7 on: December 17, 2011, 11:04:22 AM »
If the internals are still in your cat, capping it off will cause it to clog up and cut your power VERY quickly because they aren't anaerobic!
AMC/Jeep gauges are for amusement only. Any correlation between them and reality is purely coincidental!

Offline GRONK

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #8 on: December 17, 2011, 01:31:29 PM »
apping a non-functional air feed tube will not cause the cat to clog fast.  Most cats have the optional air supply tube.  It's more of a cheater system than a functional one.  If you buy an aftermarket cat it will almost always come with a capped off supply tube.
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Offline carnuck

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #9 on: December 18, 2011, 12:12:09 AM »
That's because aftermarket cats are required to have the tube to be able to hook up to the original AIR for looks and not function. Cap off an OEM one and the car's floor will get VERY warm in a hurry if the internals are still in it.

<--- 30 years tech emission certified and I just renewed my ASE for the third time. AFAIK, I'm the only partsman in WA working for NAPA that's parts and tech certified (I also passed the Mechanical Engineer's cert test with 85% without studying when they gave me the wrong test by accident)
AMC/Jeep gauges are for amusement only. Any correlation between them and reality is purely coincidental!

Offline Zoro

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #10 on: December 18, 2011, 12:24:15 AM »
So I guess I'll fix it then ???
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263,000 miles and counting!

Offline carguy87

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #11 on: December 18, 2011, 09:57:20 AM »
Or you can pull it out and put in a delete pipe for 2 benefits.  One being a little less exhaust restriction and a better exhaust note, the other being a little more cash in your pocket after you take it to a scrapyard.  Some of those cats can fetch up to $80 a piece. ;D

68AMXGOPAC

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2011, 07:49:54 PM »
Wish my cat would fetch $80 , would be a good change from just mice. :rotfl:

Offline captspillane

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #13 on: December 19, 2011, 02:42:53 AM »
A cordless drill with a very long drill bit makes quick work of the catalyst material. It'll come out in huge chunks once a few holes are drilled in it. The best delete pipe is one that doesn't look like a delete pipe.

Its a ceramic looking honeycomb with extremely small holes. The biggest problem is soot building up and clogging the holes, since the material itself doesn't change as it does its job. That's why it is so valuable, a catalyst isn't consumed it just spurs other materials to chemically react in its presence. Old converters have the soot and rusty metal removed and the powder goes right into a new outer shell. The feedback line is designed to introduce more oxygen into the converter to assist the catalyst in chemically reacting more pollutants. The increased oxygen was considered a good thing until fuel injection systems starting to rely on oxygen sensors to control the percentage of fuel vapor injected. Its no longer necessary when severely rich or lean conditions are eliminated and its not even an option on modern cars with a downstream oxygen sensor. A universal catalytic converter comes with a cap on the input line to be used with fuel injected motors. Once you remove that cap you have an exhaust leak unless it is connected to a system designed with a one way check valve to prevent exhaust from coming out.

Specifically the increased oxygen was said to react with unburned fuel particles and cause a secondary combustion that would heat up the converter, in turn increasing the effectiveness of the catalyst with the higher internal temperatures. The hotter your catalytic converter is, the more likely harmful secondary outputs like NOx and carbon monoxide will react to form harmless water vapor or carbon dioxide. That means that capping off the OEM converter input or having an inoperative pulse-air system will decrease the temperature of the catalytic converter, not increase it. Only soot buildup and the resulting restriction and back pressure can cause an increase in temperature, but its effective enough to make the catalytic converter get so hot that it glows red before its bad enough to stall the engine. This link doesn't offer much in the "Air Injection" section, but for what its worth it does support the statements I made.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalytic_converter
 
The converter starts to get super hot during operation long before it puts so much back pressure on the engine that it stops running well. My Jeep Cherokee had a rug fire as a direct result of the converter underneath it. That happened around 230K miles on the OEM converter, before we could tell the engine was struggling. Thankfully it was my third car fire, so a fire extinguisher was on hand. Obviously I've learned the hard way to replace them at least every 150K miles. At night I walked past our Eagle sedan once and the ground was glowing because the converter was cherry red. Replacing that one made a huge difference to the engine, but it was the threat of fire that motivated us to do it.
« Last Edit: December 19, 2011, 03:24:46 AM by captspillane »
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Offline carnuck

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Re: Looked under the Eagle, got a surprise
« Reply #14 on: December 23, 2011, 03:52:31 PM »
I have learned that if you use an aftermarket non-aerobic cat and leave the AIR system on (where it pumps into the exhaust manifold and not the side pipe) the new cat will burn out in no time.
AMC/Jeep gauges are for amusement only. Any correlation between them and reality is purely coincidental!

 

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