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Author Topic: Engine shutting down while driving  (Read 32631 times)

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Offline Nightpath

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Engine shutting down while driving
« on: May 01, 2014, 02:37:36 AM »
So my Eagle is road legal and I've been enjoying it., t a.

Problem is after 15 km of driving or so the engine stalls out. It restarts without a problem every time.

I have a new solenoid and hei distributor in it,  engine seems to run fine then it either dies totally or becomes intermittent then dies.

Thoughts?  I'm leaning towards a bad coil in the HEI, or possilby a bad starter solenoid (don't think it's this).

Anyone have a few suggestions?
« Last Edit: May 01, 2014, 07:09:00 AM by Nightpath »

Offline doneagle

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2014, 09:34:57 AM »

         HI    This is off the wall but have you tried the gas filter ....that's what mine did ......not seeing how it does its hard to tell for me any way ..I like to see and hear what is going on ...........don
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2014, 10:52:45 AM »
Has a new gas filter.

The engine completely cuts out, not a sputter or anything. Merrily driving along then no response whatsoever.

Offline carnuck

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2014, 12:14:04 PM »
My previous wagon did that on right turns after warmed up. It turned out the thrust shim between the dist gear and housing fell apart, which allowed the shaft inside to rise above the pickup coil and kill the spark. Check the end play by pulling up and down on the rotor. I've had lots of Chevs do that too. It settles down after sitting a couple seconds and sparks like normal. First time drove me nuts. I took off the cap. Pushed down on the rotor and it fired up and drove till another long hill.
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Offline BenM

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2014, 01:49:06 PM »
The ignition module may be going, and check for lose grounds.
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2014, 04:19:32 PM »
With the HEI there is no icm. Everything is in the HEI.

Has a new fuel filter as well.

Offline IowaEagle

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2014, 04:29:28 PM »
Suspect the Motorcraft Ignition module.  It gets warm and then it stops.
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Offline BenM

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2014, 05:24:47 PM »
The HEI has a small ICM inside, it's the same functionality as the Motorcraft module and you can functionally swap them. They have similar problems.

You can pick up one at the parts store so long as it has the same number of electrical connectors.

It will look similar to these:
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #8 on: May 02, 2014, 03:47:18 PM »
Yup, the ICM is screwed. And coil.

Awesome.

Online vangremlin

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #9 on: May 02, 2014, 05:18:09 PM »
What brand HEI distributor did you get?  Can you return it for a good one?
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2014, 08:52:06 PM »
One of the ones from Skip White. I've bought one before, and have recommended them, to the extent that I've seen a few over the past couple of years and never saw any issues.

Just luck of the draw I suppose. They are going to send out a ICM and coil to replace the faulty parts so I'm not too worried.

Offline carnuck

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2014, 09:02:21 PM »
Make sure the ignition coil has the ground strap! I fried 3 modules and a pickup coil before I noticed the one in my '82 C20 with 454 was missing it. The PO gave up on the truck because of it. That and the 10 mpg from the Edelbrock package.
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Offline JayRamb

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2014, 09:46:10 PM »
After ALL kinds of trouble shooting, it was my ignition module. I bought an UPGRADED  on that had MORE ventilation on the back side with deeper air-pockets. Haven't had troubles since.
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #13 on: June 26, 2014, 04:08:18 PM »
Swapped out the ICM, car has a few vacuum issues, but the :censored: still randomly stalls out at any point.

I'm starting to think it's electrical. Car dies, have to pull over and it starts up no problem, but it's like the :censored: thing just shits the bed. Getting pretty :censored: over it.

Offline mudkicker715

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #14 on: June 26, 2014, 06:22:19 PM »
I have had a fuseable link shut all power to the car off.



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Offline eaglefreek

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #15 on: June 26, 2014, 06:35:18 PM »
Where are you getting the power from for the HEI? I would suggest running new power and ground wires to the HEI to eliminate that as the cause. Is it possible you may have some crap in the float bowl that is clogging the jets?
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Offline carnuck

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #16 on: June 26, 2014, 11:22:00 PM »
make sure the thrust washer between the dist gear and body didn't disintegrate! Too much upward play lifts the rotator away from the pickup coil and kills the spark.
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2014, 12:01:14 AM »
HEI has something wrong internally. Eating and ruining the ICM constantly. I've replaced it with the original ignition system and swapped my carb out, running fine now.

Have to send the HEI back which sucks a lot. Can't wait till I change to the new engine.

Offline JayRamb

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2014, 03:41:33 PM »
I have heard a LOT of bad with HEI's. Even my buddies installed HEI was terrible and he went back to the OEM. Hmmmm. Maybe Eagles aren't meant to have HEI's!?
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Offline ISOAR

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #19 on: June 30, 2014, 07:15:16 PM »
I had a similar experience as Mudkicker with a fusible link on a Vette I had. It would be running great and then just die. I turned out the fusible link had burned but the insulation was still intact. When it got hot from driving, it would stretch and break contact and cause the engine to die. After cooling, the insulation would shrink allowing the two sides of the wire to make contact again and would run fine....until it warmed up enough to stretch again.

Offline IowaEagle

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #20 on: June 30, 2014, 07:19:50 PM »
Are these the Skip White units or used components, or .....?
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Offline carnuck

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #21 on: July 02, 2014, 12:51:00 PM »
If you assemble the unit yourself from a junkyard dist and the rest all new parts, keep in mind there is a ground strap for the in cap coils that is 100% needed! Otherwise you get backfires, cut outs and lots of other horrible running problems or not running at all. DON'T use the Motorcraft dist gear on them! The center hole is too large and the gear will wallow around on the dist shaft and self-destruct, often taking the cam shaft with it!
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #22 on: July 02, 2014, 09:31:07 PM »
This is indeed a Skip White HEI distributor.

I might take it apart a bit to see if I can notice anything. It has a lifetime warranty but it's $30 to send it back :/

Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #23 on: July 03, 2014, 07:10:01 AM »
So it's not the HEI. It's not the old ignition system.

After about 15 minutes of driving it starts to :censored: the bed. Just dies rampantly.

I have replaced the whole :censored: ignition system from the original to HEI to the original I had in my other Eagle. 3 ignition systems and identical issues.

Only thing I can see now is the starter solenoid. Maybe it's heating up and something internally is disconnecting. I know they're simple but I remember a few months ago working on a friends winch that the solenoid went bad in.

Anyone have any other suggestions??

Offline Mernsy

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #24 on: July 03, 2014, 07:43:31 AM »
Fusible link?

Check for heat in the solenoid and in the wires coming off the solenoid.

Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #25 on: July 03, 2014, 09:58:43 AM »
Is there a fusable link in there that could be causing it?

Reason I ask is that the battery goes to the solenoid, which goes directly to the distributor.

Since I've replaced ALL parts of the ignition system 3 times, the only real thing that's left for me to replace is the solenoid. I've even replaced the alternator along with new wiring for that.

The shut down is almost on queue...15 minutes of driving then it starts to turn off repeatedly and randomly. This leads me to believe it's a heat related issue definitely.

Offline carnuck

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #26 on: July 03, 2014, 02:43:30 PM »
I had that problem when my alt had a shorted diode that caused it to make AC instead of DC voltage.
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Offline BenM

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #27 on: July 03, 2014, 02:48:09 PM »
How's your fuel system? Is the bypass filter installed with the bypass at the top? Are the vent and return lines clear? Is there a hissing sound when you remove the gas cap?

A clogged vent line can cause problems.

I'm trying to think of things that change from a cold start. Those are the MCU, several temperature electrical switches, and the CTO or Dual CTO switch. After it dies and restarts, do you get another 15 minutes or is it bad from then on out?
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Offline carnuck

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #28 on: July 03, 2014, 02:53:49 PM »
Another possibility, if you are running a manual fuel pump without a filter before it, is crud in the line is jamming the inlet valve open or the tank fuel sock is collapsing and locking the inlet.
AMC/Jeep gauges are for amusement only. Any correlation between them and reality is purely coincidental!

Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #29 on: July 03, 2014, 03:26:36 PM »
I swapped the solenoid to the original and the car ran non stop for a half hour which it hasn't done since I put the new one in.

Going to run it like this for a few days before I swap the hei back into it.

Offline IowaEagle

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #30 on: July 03, 2014, 03:53:10 PM »
Most of the new solenoids are made in China or Mexico, so that is not surprising.
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #31 on: July 07, 2014, 09:21:22 AM »
Found something else that wasn't helping. The electric choke, which I didn't really pay attention to, has a fuse near the battery. Was poking around last night when I noticed it. Swapped it out so the choke now works.

It was allowing the butterfly to flop around, randomly closing the carb.

I might take the butterfly out and figure a way to make it a bit heavier on the larger side to ensure it doesn't want to flop closed.

Offline Mernsy

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #32 on: July 07, 2014, 09:58:30 AM »
Someone has wired that in themselves.

The power to the electric choke should come from the oil pressure sending unit.

Offline BenM

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #33 on: July 07, 2014, 02:56:29 PM »
Before you mess with the choke, the choke butterfly should not be loose. The spring in the choke housing should be securely attached to the choke, and the vacuum pull-off should be adjusted to prevent the choke from closing when vacuum is applied. (The choke is prevented from closing when the engine is running.) The choke butterfly is not controlled by weight or gravity but by spring tension.

The choke and the electric manifold heater should be controlled by the oil switch and not fused that way. If the manifold heater is not working the choke and idle jets are often set too rich to compensate resulting in problems with stalling out during warmup when the engine runs too rich. It also thins out your oil and wears out your engine faster.
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #34 on: July 08, 2014, 06:59:22 AM »
Any pictures of how it should be? Making me think that the choke spring might be on backwards.


Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #36 on: July 08, 2014, 10:43:20 AM »
So the arm from the butterfly connector sits in the "cup" of the choke spring correct?

Offline Mernsy

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #37 on: July 08, 2014, 11:26:28 AM »
Yes.

Offline BenM

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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #39 on: July 10, 2014, 09:57:07 PM »
Any directions as to which wire the carb hooks into?

Offline Mernsy

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #40 on: July 11, 2014, 04:44:52 AM »
Should be a dark blue wire and a dark blue wire with a tracer in a female plug.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2014, 07:10:01 AM by Mernsy »

Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #41 on: July 11, 2014, 07:57:54 AM »
So the dark blue wire comes off the electrical connector that the oil pressure switch is connected to. I'll take a look at it. Seems like the old :censored: really did some great wiring jobs in the Eagle.

Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #42 on: July 12, 2014, 12:08:23 PM »
Does the electric choke have to be hooked up to the oil pressure switch?

I can't seem to find the wires you're talking about.

Offline Mernsy

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #43 on: July 12, 2014, 02:44:12 PM »
Not really. It should be because the power goes to the manifold heater after the choke.
Try following the wires from the oil pressure sender.

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #44 on: July 14, 2014, 01:09:22 PM »
It's a drivability issue with the oil pressure switch. It prevents the electric choke from heating up until the engine has started. At the least you want an ignition circuit, one that is on only in the "run" position and never any other time. Otherwise you listen to your radio one day waiting for someone and your car won't start.

The manifold heater draws a lot of current, the oil pressure switch triggers a relay somewhere taped into the wiring harness one the firewall (that might help you find the wires). It's like a set of diesel glow plugs, and AMC didn't want it killing your battery if the alternator wasn't running to power it.

The part of the harness that controls the oil pressure switch, manifold heater, and choke heater is a sub-harness that plugs into the main harness somewhere on the passenger side.

Here's a diagram of the circuit.
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Offline mo.eagles

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #45 on: June 12, 2015, 01:51:54 PM »
This is kind of old but I'm hoping to get more info. Nightpath, did the solenoid solve the problem? I had the same problem with the wagon I got in Arkansas . It would just shut off but restart with no problem. Running down the hiway and die . Put it in neutral at 60 and it would restart and go. Then it ran great with no issues for 2 years .Now it's acting up again. Not all the time ,maybe once a week, but it is aggravating.
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Offline Nightpath

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #46 on: June 16, 2015, 10:40:22 AM »
I fixed mine 100% by doing a drivetrain swap ;)

Mine was the crap solenoid causing issues, and a crap battery. It was getting voltage spikes or none at all, and was killing the car repeatedly after 15 minutes of driving.

Offline elizapekai

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #47 on: August 16, 2020, 10:41:26 PM »
Hi! I have an ‘84 and it’s been doing a lot of the same things that I’m reading on here and I’m really hoping someone has a solution for me. It randomly kills at the weirdest times. I could drive 30min and it’d be fine or it would kill every block. I’ve replaced the: distributer, fuel filter, coil, starter, spark plugs, caps and rotors, abt 2yrs ago we did wires, and we even have a new battery in it. None of these have worked tho, she still kills randomly and Idk what I’m missing. Help! XD
« Last Edit: August 16, 2020, 10:42:21 PM by elizapekai »

Offline Taylor

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #48 on: August 17, 2020, 07:18:26 AM »
Might be the icu? It is mounted under the solenoid on the left fender. I replaced mine about 10-11 years ago. The wires come out upwards, it puts a bit of a strain on them and they can crack. Mine were. Finally replaced all of it with a hei.
I bought my old icu from rock auto and last I checked they still had them.
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Offline Canoe

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Re: Engine shutting down while driving
« Reply #49 on: August 20, 2020, 10:19:45 AM »
Hi! I have an ‘84 and it’s been doing a lot of the same things that I’m reading on here and I’m really hoping someone has a solution for me. It randomly kills at the weirdest times. I could drive 30min and it’d be fine or it would kill every block. I’ve replaced the: distributer, fuel filter, coil, starter, spark plugs, caps and rotors, abt 2yrs ago we did wires, and we even have a new battery in it. None of these have worked tho, she still kills randomly and Idk , I’m missing. Help! XD
So many things it can be. (With one of mine, it was the stock coil)
Can you describe:
- the weather when this happens (wet/dry, temp)
- how does it fail: sputters, rpm falls off to dead, or suddenly nothing from running fine, etc.

First thing I'd check is all of the wires to/from the starting solenoid, ignition module, distributor and coil.

I'm a major fan of the GM ignition module as a replacement. You supply it with full voltage (instead of the stock reduced voltage through the ballast resistor) and it manages the current to the coil if needed.

You can also upgrade to a stronger coil, but will need to upgrade the distributor cap and wires to handle the higher spark voltage.

Do check the Eaglepedia for a wealth of information
http://amceaglesden.com/guide/index.php?title=Main_Page

 

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