Diesel/Gas Electric Eagle - would it fly?

[Canoe]

With these hybrid gas/electric (they keep the good diesel/electric ones in Europe) we're seeing some pretty powerful electric motors. I understand that some of these electric motors drive the wheels without a transmission between them and the wheel, geared such that their 0 rpm to their top rpm corresponds to the vehicle 0 mph to its top speed.

What if we could convert an Eagle to have a direct drive electric motor at each wheel.

We could elliminate:

• front diff and axles
• drive shafts
• transfer case
• transmission

And the rear axle could be changed to something independent on each side?

The engine would stay to drive a generator to provide the wheel drive current. Except for very low speed, the gas engine would always be running when the vehicle is in motion.

And we'd add:

• generator
• an extra battery or two, to accumulate charge for peak loads (or to 'get-away' from a stop light while the engine turns back on)
• four high current controllers driven by "gas pedal" input

The engine would be driven based on current requirements, so the generator is geared or belt connected to have the engine running at it's most efficient. There should also be a net drop in total vehicle weight?

And the gas engine could be replaced by a diesel? Say a lister?

Would it fly?

I bet I could go from my place to the store and back on two standard batteries, maybe one.

Any views on why it would or wouldn't?

[Gil-SX4]

Isnt diesel more expensive then gasoline

[mccastlej]

At the moment diesel is more expensive than gasoline, but not all the time.  There are many benifits to having a diesel motor.  The fuel consumption is much less, and for the norm the diesel engines will run much longer than a gas engine before they need a rebuild.  Usually at least twice as long depending on the manufacturer. 

[IowaEagle]

Ahhhhh -- the diesel electric locomotive reinvented.  I don't know if there would be any weight savings.  Diesel would probably be best but a small maybe 3 or 4 cylinder one would help with weight.  Modern locomotives have switched to Alternators vs. the older Generators.  I forget if the traction motors are AC or DC.  I guess one of the issues with hybrids is the potential for high voltage shock in an accident. 

[eaglefreek]

Anything would work if you have enough $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

[Canoe]

some points/assumptions

The diesel is more efficient than the gas engine, even though they weight a little more, although not that much with the modern diesels. They can also run on biodiesel without modification, and with heated fuel pickups and heated fuel lines and a boost in temperature just prior to the injector pump (heat source can be electric or engine coolant), they can run on vegetable oil (non-hydrgenated canola or soy being best).

(I keep forgetting that the hybrid electric motors use a wide and high range of voltages.)

Using a generator with rare earth magnets, one could have the engine drive the shaft with the magnets on it, to have a brushless generator - lots of juice for the weight and less upkeep.

A generator is heavier than an alternator (magnets vs. windings) but the d.c. doesn't have to be converted from a.c. to d.c..

Depending on the load requirements, one might be able to take a page from the off-the-grid hydro projects and modify large alternators from self exciting to rare earth magnet. On the other side a self exciting alternator can be modified to have a simple control circuit for the exciting load, such that one can vary the alternator load to match the gas motor to keep it operating at its most efficient.

I guess I need to find out more about these new electric motors, as in weight, voltage, current, torque, rpm, etc..

I am much intrigued.

[BenM]

Well, for instance, the Jetta goes from ~27 to ~50 when moving from a 1.8 turbo gasoline to a 1.9 turbo diesel. They're similar in performance, and the diesel is heavier.

With modern alternators/motors like they use in the new hybrids, it may work. I'd imagine either a motor for each axle, or one replacing the transmission on the t-case, but it depends on sizes available.

It would be great for trail crawling, at least. Probably cheaper then investing in a new transmission, gears, t-case and aux. transmission like some guys have.

[Ayem Sea]

AHH he mentioned volkswagens! I thought this was an all american motors safe haven. Well, I'm asking for it, going on the hybrid subject...

[IowaEagle]

AMC did use VW engines for short time.  So I guess we can give him a pass.

[rollguy]

Another thought is that a Diesel engine has more torque than a gas engine, so it can be geared to run slower, therefore using much less fuel. I have seen small Diesel generators that put out a lot of power, and are also very quiet. I have been doing a lot of research on Diesel engines, Biodiesel, and SVO or WVO as fuel. I am convinced that that is the only way to go. I am turning into a "Diesel Guy" in a hurry! I am looking to sell all of my gas vehicles, and go Diesel powered. Don't worry about me leaving the Eagle Nest, as I have the '80 Turbo Diesel Eagle!

[IowaEagle]

No worry hear.  I wonder if AMC was thinking about Diesels.  They probably saw what happened to GM and shied away.  Perhaps your car was one they were going to watch and see if they would make more???  A Diesel electric, to me, makes more sense since they are ideal for that application.  You don't see many (any more) gas-electric locomotives.  Gas-electric railroad equipment was primarily used in single unit commuter applications and in some very early freight locomotives -- they just did not have the reliability or longevity of the diesel units.

[Ayem Sea]

AMC did use VW engines for short time.  So I guess we can give him a pass.

I had a feeling someone'd say that; it could happen on a mopar forum too, if the subject were plymouth horizons and dodge omnis....

[83Eagle!]

I think that is the way that Daimler Chrysler could bring back the Eagle...  Market it as a hybrid sport utility vehicle.  They don't really have such a thing do they?  I know they are looking into flex fuel vehicles and turbo diesels.  But they do not have a directly hybrid vehicle on the market do they?  Other than the Dodge Sprinter??

[lmhsx/4]

  As I own 23 diesel fuel injectors. would like to find a diesel to fit the SX/4. Hard to find a good fit. What about the diesel engine in Isuzu NPR & Nissan delivery trucks?

   I have noticed when setting the cruise control on the "TDI" when driving hills on highway will actually pull away from gas powered. As for millage, a few weeks ago drove from east Iowa to Ann Arbor, MI and back. 21 gallons of fuel. About 47 MPG. Have done better. Could not hold a constant speed, to much stop & go.


 

[Bird-o-Prey]

Try this link.  Have a look.  Just drop an eagle body on it.  Probably cheaper than all the mods required to make a stock Eagle a hybrid.

http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2010/02/trexa-electric-car-platform-will-cost-upwards-of-us15999/

Cheers