Author Topic: Lots of engine swap questions! Please Help. (Read 9957 times)

Tony and Nicki · « **on:** February 27, 2011, 06:53:32 PM »

Hi guys,

We’ve been out of sight for the last 7 months since our 1980 Concord threw a rod. We’ve been waiting for a suitable donor engine to turn up locally that we could afford (we paid $250) and that finally happened so we’re getting ready to install it. We think it has 128,000 miles on it so it’s no spring chicken but not too tired.

The donor came from a ‘77 CJ7 that we were able to see/hear running. It’s pretty clean and sounded really good. No smoke no knocks no leaks.
The seller got it off his dad who had it in his jeep for a short while who had got if off the original owner. The guy who sold it had only had it in for a month before he decided to upgrade to a V8.

Anyway I have some questions that maybe someone can answer. First of all, the engine still has everything on it including a 1bl carb/manifold set up. What I was wondering is would it be a good idea to keep that in terms of economy? If so, how would that work out in terms of throttle linkage etc.?

Also I’ve been doing some cross referencing and I noticed that certain items are not the same part number on the ‘77 258 as the ‘80. For instance, the Water Pump. They look the same so I was wondering are they different ‘cos of the rotation is a different direction? Same goes for the Power Steering Pump?

I also noticed the Fly wheels are different even though the teeth count, OD and pitch are the same. I guess it’s no big deal as I can just transfer Concord’s flywheel over to the jeep engine right? However just curious.

The other thing is the ‘77 jeep engine would have had points type distributer but this one has had a conversion to pointless that looks pretty recent and I was wondering if it would be worth keeping it and if so how it would work out in terms of the electric hook up. The Concord dizzy has 4 wires coming from the module whereas the ‘new’ engine has two.

Sorry it’s a lot of questions but I’m still new to AMC’s so I’m on a steep learning curve right now.

Cheers!
Nicki and Tony
Tucson Az

Pictures will follow.

vangremlin · « **Reply #1 on:** February 27, 2011, 11:22:58 PM »

It was my understanding that donor engines had to come from '80 or later Jeeps so that it has the proper holes (bosses?) to connect the front drive components to the engine. Hope I'm not the bearer of bad news.

mudkicker715 · « **Reply #2 on:** February 27, 2011, 11:36:21 PM »

With a concord they have no worries about axle mountability vangremlin.

IowaEagle · « **Reply #3 on:** February 28, 2011, 06:18:25 AM »

Yup, they have a Concord.

vangremlin · « **Reply #4 on:** March 01, 2011, 10:46:32 PM »

Oops, my bad. I should pay closer attention to what I read! I'm glad that's not going to be an issue then.

Tony and Nicki · « **Reply #5 on:** March 02, 2011, 07:48:20 PM »

I just noticed that the Jeep and Concord's oil pans are not the same. This normally wouldn't be a problem, but I can't transfer the Concord's oil pan to the Jeep engine because the Concord's got a hole in it from when I threw the rod. So my question is: Would I be able to use the Jeep oil pan, or does anybody have an oil pan or know where I could get one that I could use? I'm assuming that I would need to get a donor from an Eagle, Concord, or Spirit...I actually have no idea.

Any information is helpful. Thanks,
Tony and Nicki

vangremlin · « **Reply #6 on:** March 02, 2011, 09:19:56 PM »

Can you get the current pan repaired? When I got my Kammback, there was a hole drilled in the gas tank, and I took it to an old school radiator shop and they were able to patch it.

Tony and Nicki · « **Reply #7 on:** March 02, 2011, 11:48:27 PM »

Thanks Vangremlin,

Yes I think it can be repaired if needs be. Maybe a metal patch welded on?.

Cheers!
Nicki and Tony

vangremlin · « **Reply #8 on:** March 03, 2011, 12:32:28 AM »

Quote from: Tony and Nicki on March 02, 2011, 11:48:27 PM

Thanks Vangremlin,

Yes I think it can be repaired if needs be. Maybe a metal patch welded on?.

Cheers!
Nicki and Tony

I think that would be a pretty easy fix for an oil pan since its not a high pressure application.

Tony and Nicki · « **Reply #9 on:** March 03, 2011, 04:37:02 AM »

Thanks vangremlin,

Yes I was thinking the same thing. Should be an easy fix to patch up an oil pan. One thing that was pointed out to me by venosho is that if I install a Concord Oil Pan I may have to transfer the Oil Pump also.

cheers!

vangremlin · « **Reply #10 on:** March 03, 2011, 09:20:18 PM »

Quote from: Tony and Nicki on March 03, 2011, 04:37:02 AM

One thing that was pointed out to me by venosho is that if I install a Concord Oil Pan I may have to transfer the Oil Pump also.

I put a Jeep engine in my Eagle, and had to transfer the oil pan and oil pump to the Jeep engine. We originally tried to just transfer the oil pump pickup and pan. It was a lot more work to try and transfer the pickup, and in the end it was not compatible with the Jeep oil pump. Learn from my mistake, transfer the whole pump.

thereverendbill · « **Reply #11 on:** March 03, 2011, 10:09:59 PM »

if it comes down to changing the pan do yourself a favor and buy a new pump. Then you are rest assured that the oil pump is new

Tony and Nicki · « **Reply #12 on:** March 04, 2011, 09:17:20 PM »

Ok thanks vangremlin, I figure I would transfer the Concord's pump in the event that I have to use a Concord Oil Pan.
I may even buy a new pump as reverendbill suggests.
In any case I noticed on cross referencing at the Autozone site that the '77 jeep has a possible two Oil pumps. One is the same part # as '80 Concord and one is not. I guess it depends if it's the 'tab type' or 'no tab type'. Concord's shows as a no tab. Then when it comes to pick up tube/screens the jeeps and concord's are not the same. I suppose 'cos of the different shaped pans.
It is possible that the jeep pan might work though. It's about 13" or 14" from the front to where the pan dips down which is about the same as concord's so it might work.
The damage to Concord's pan is a bit worse than 1st noticed but should be fixable. There is a 1980 AMC pan on e bay right now that looks the same as Concord's but he wants $50 + $20 shipping for it and I'm not sure if I wanna spring for that right now with finances being what they are and a baby on the way in 5 weeks etc.

Cheers!
Nicki and Tony

thereverendbill · « **Reply #13 on:** March 04, 2011, 09:26:09 PM »

gratz on the new baby (well pre gratz). back to the topic .... if there are any pit marks on either pan I would suggest on just purchasing a non pitted pan, those pits quickly turn into holes from my past experiences

vangremlin · « **Reply #14 on:** March 04, 2011, 10:03:07 PM »

I don't know about the Concord oil pumps, but from my experience the Jeep and Eagle oil pumps were not interchangable, because the screen wouldn't fit in the Eagle pan, and you can't transfer a tab screen with a non-tab pump, and visa versa. It just doesn't work. I would agree with Bill's suggestion if you can find the right oil pump, but I was never able to find the right pump to fit the Eagle.

Tony and Nicki · « **Reply #15 on:** March 17, 2011, 08:14:09 PM »

Hi guys,

Everything's going well. I got the Concord engine out and will be putting it in the stand on Monday. I've decided to get a new Oil Pump but I have a question. According to the shop manual it suggests getting a new inlet tube/screen if the tube is disturbed to ensure an airtight seal.
No problem I'll get a new tube also. But I see a tool (J-211882) that I 'need' to install the tube. Does anyone know where I can get one or if there's a way to install it without the special tool?

BTW I'll be needing a new Exhaust Manifold also. It appears that it cracked at the mounting area and also broke off a chunk when, what's left of the Exhaust assembly, fell down. From what I can tell the jeep's one is not the same.

Cheers!
Tony and Nicki

vangremlin · « **Reply #16 on:** March 17, 2011, 10:37:54 PM »

Quote from: Tony and Nicki on March 17, 2011, 08:14:09 PM

No problem I'll get a new tube also. But I see a tool (J-211882) that I 'need' to install the tube. Does anyone know where I can get one or if there's a way to install it without the special tool?

Cheers!
Tony and Nicki

My experience is that its pretty hard to do without the tool. I went to Autozone or O'Reilly's and rented a generic oil pump pickup removal/installing tool. It worked great and didn't cost any money.

Tony and Nicki · « **Reply #17 on:** March 17, 2011, 11:07:40 PM »

OK thanks vangremlin,

I'll check out the local zone then. I've used their loan-a-tool service before for a Coil Spring Compressor. Gotta love that service!!!
What do you think about transferring the Concord's inlet tube to the new pump? Although I think a new tube is only $13 but I can't see why it wouldn't be OK.

Cheers!
Tony and Nicki

vangremlin · « **Reply #18 on:** March 18, 2011, 12:19:01 AM »

Quote from: Tony and Nicki on March 17, 2011, 11:07:40 PM

OK thanks vangremlin,

I'll check out the local zone then. I've used their loan-a-tool service before for a Coil Spring Compressor. Gotta love that service!!!
What do you think about transferring the Concord's inlet tube to the new pump? Although I think a new tube is only $13 but I can't see why it wouldn't be OK.

Cheers!
Tony and Nicki

It is a great service. I've rented the spring compressor also!

You have to check to see that the new inlet tube has the same shape as the old one, and also is the old one compatible with the new pump if you want to go that route. I ran into that problem when I swapped a Jeep engine into my Eagle.

Tony and Nicki · « **Reply #19 on:** March 18, 2011, 05:23:38 AM »

OK thanks again vg,

I looked on the autozone site but couldn't see the oil pump inlet tube installation tool. Maybe they have it at my local store but it's not listed online? Anyway I'll ask 'em and see what they say.

Cheers!
tony and Nicki