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Author Topic: Discussion of built driveline  (Read 90623 times)

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Offline The Dark Side of Will

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #120 on: April 23, 2014, 09:04:19 AM »
Absolutely... it will be heavily gusseted. This is only an intermediate step.

Offline DaemonForce

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #121 on: May 14, 2014, 02:43:00 AM »
I have to be honest, I've been following this thread for a very LONG time now trying to follow the warnings about what all I can expect to encounter with the 4.7L swap but wtf is going on with that bracket? I have never seen this on a Cherokee, Commanche, Wrangler, Wagoneer or anything. It's just a weird support bracket that hangs off the Eagle's Dana 30. Does this make the Eagle 258 or Dana 30 unique just because of this support bracket? Is there an effortless way to work around this? I'm going to do some dry fitting in the morning and I hope I don't have this issue since my 4.0L block is an early model from an 89 Cherokee but I get the feeling this is going to be a big deal anyway. :-\
1983 Limited
AMC 258C {R2:27.Jun.13}
Carter 2681 {R2:28.Oct.12}
TorqueFlite A998 {R6: -20.Apr.12}
NP129 {R2:28.Apr.12}
M35-273 {???}
Compression: 0
Corrected Idle: 0RPM

Rebuild:
???

Offline Mernsy

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #122 on: May 14, 2014, 06:46:49 AM »
The mounting boss on the 4.2 block, where the bracket bolts on, should also be on your 4.o block. You may have to drill and tap the hole, though, in order to bolt the bracket on.

Offline The Dark Side of Will

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #123 on: May 14, 2014, 09:06:43 AM »
I have to be honest, I've been following this thread for a very LONG time now trying to follow the warnings about what all I can expect to encounter with the 4.7L swap but wtf is going on with that bracket? I have never seen this on a Cherokee, Commanche, Wrangler, Wagoneer or anything. It's just a weird support bracket that hangs off the Eagle's Dana 30. Does this make the Eagle 258 or Dana 30 unique just because of this support bracket? Is there an effortless way to work around this? I'm going to do some dry fitting in the morning and I hope I don't have this issue since my 4.0L block is an early model from an 89 Cherokee but I get the feeling this is going to be a big deal anyway. :-\

The Eagles use Dana 30 IFS, which bolts to the engine block via brackets.
Other Jeeps use solid front axles, which do not bolt to the engine block. That's why you don't see the same brackets on a Jeep.
There are ribs on the 4.0 block that prevent the Eagle bracket from bolting up. The mounting holes are there, and were tapped in my block. Many people grind the ribs down. I chose not to.
I modified the Eagle bracket to clear the ribs.
I found that the Jeep exhaust manifold put the pipe in a place such that it would interfere with the bracket.
Faced with the option of modifying the manifold AND making a custom exhaust pipe OR making the bracket from scratch that would clear the unmodified Jeep exhaust manifold and pipe, I chose to build the bracket from scratch.

Offline BenM

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #124 on: May 14, 2014, 12:51:37 PM »
I have to be honest, I've been following this thread for a very LONG time now trying to follow the warnings about what all I can expect to encounter with the 4.7L swap but wtf is going on with that bracket? I have never seen this on a Cherokee, Commanche, Wrangler, Wagoneer or anything. It's just a weird support bracket that hangs off the Eagle's Dana 30. Does this make the Eagle 258 or Dana 30 unique just because of this support bracket? Is there an effortless way to work around this? I'm going to do some dry fitting in the morning and I hope I don't have this issue since my 4.0L block is an early model from an 89 Cherokee but I get the feeling this is going to be a big deal anyway. :-\

AMC was very clever. While they couldn't do the completely isolated front suspension like they did in the Pacer, hanging the front differential from the engine instead of the unibody reduces noise and vibration. It also means that the front drive shaft doesn't move up and down so clearances could be tight even as the engine flexes on its mounts. I'm surprised they didn't continue to use the isocalmp pads on the Eagle rear springs.
NSS#47184

1987 AMC Eagle Sedan -- 1976 Pacer Coupe -- 1968 Pontiac Tempest Custom S -- 1940 Mercury (& a 2002 Jetta Turbodiesel, 5 spd., the Wife's Daily Driver)

Offline carnuck

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #125 on: May 14, 2014, 01:25:06 PM »
I'm GLAD they didn't use that rubbish design! Once they get a year or so old in rusty areas, they start twisting and break loose from the leaf springs. Even worse offroad.
AMC/Jeep gauges are for amusement only. Any correlation between them and reality is purely coincidental!

Offline DaemonForce

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #126 on: May 16, 2014, 04:02:38 PM »
Interesting question. Does a Dana 44 IFS exist on ordinary junkyard Jeeps and if so, will it bolt up to an Eagle that is equipped with the 4.0L block?
1983 Limited
AMC 258C {R2:27.Jun.13}
Carter 2681 {R2:28.Oct.12}
TorqueFlite A998 {R6: -20.Apr.12}
NP129 {R2:28.Apr.12}
M35-273 {???}
Compression: 0
Corrected Idle: 0RPM

Rebuild:
???

Offline eaglefreek

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #127 on: May 16, 2014, 05:01:23 PM »
Interesting question. Does a Dana 44 IFS exist on ordinary junkyard Jeeps and if so, will it bolt up to an Eagle that is equipped with the 4.0L block?
As far as I know, there is no such thing as a Jeep front IFS Dana44 or any IFS Dana 44 besides the Ford TTB. GM used a 7.25 front IFS on Syclones and Typhoons with lots of horsepower and the internal dimensions are almost exactly the same as the Dana 30. I would keep the Dana and spend money on stronger custom half shafts.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2014, 05:32:45 PM by eaglefreek »
1986 AMC Eagle Wagon 4.2L/4.0L head, AW4,NP242, Chrysler 8.25" rear.
1981 AMC Eagle Wagon As Seen On TV  Lost In Transmission


 

"I know he'd be a poorer man, if he never saw an eagle fly,
Rocky mountain high"  John Denver
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Offline DaemonForce

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #128 on: May 17, 2014, 03:49:40 AM »
Yeah after looking over my options I'm starting to think the best course of action is to rebuild my spare Dana 30, keep the 2.73 gearing for now, stuff a locker in it and then bolt it up. All the experimental stuff will have to wait until I get this thing running again.
1983 Limited
AMC 258C {R2:27.Jun.13}
Carter 2681 {R2:28.Oct.12}
TorqueFlite A998 {R6: -20.Apr.12}
NP129 {R2:28.Apr.12}
M35-273 {???}
Compression: 0
Corrected Idle: 0RPM

Rebuild:
???

Offline carnuck

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #129 on: May 18, 2014, 05:29:54 PM »
The only Jeep IFS D44 I know of is ancient. '65 pickups and Wagoneers. It was too fussy so they dropped it.
AMC/Jeep gauges are for amusement only. Any correlation between them and reality is purely coincidental!

Offline DaemonForce

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #130 on: May 24, 2014, 12:58:40 AM »
The only Jeep IFS D44 I know of is ancient. '65 pickups and Wagoneers. It was too fussy so they dropped it.
Aha! So it DID exist at one point! Huzzah! (*・ω・)ノ

At the very least it MIGHT become an option granted I ever see an old Wagoneer in my life time. I mean, of course I will, there are a few in town but none in the picking yards anymore. I'm starting to think I should visit South Portland for the first time in years but I'm not sure a full tank of gas is worth the trouble to check out ONE vehicle that has probably been all vultured apart by now. :-\
1983 Limited
AMC 258C {R2:27.Jun.13}
Carter 2681 {R2:28.Oct.12}
TorqueFlite A998 {R6: -20.Apr.12}
NP129 {R2:28.Apr.12}
M35-273 {???}
Compression: 0
Corrected Idle: 0RPM

Rebuild:
???

Offline The Dark Side of Will

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #131 on: May 26, 2014, 04:21:31 PM »
Some C4 Corvettes and all(?) Dodge Vipers use a D44 center set up for IRS. That unit may be adaptable to the front of an Eagle.

Offline The Dark Side of Will

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #132 on: June 13, 2014, 01:34:39 PM »
Old Jaguars used a D44 variation, and bolted it to their rear suspension cage via 4 bolts into a flat pad on the top of the differential housing.
It would be relatively straight forward to make mounting brackets to bolt to that pad and thus hand a Jaguar diff from the side of a 4.0 (or 4.7)

Photos:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/390861240794
http://www.ebay.com/itm/151258008342
http://www.ebay.com/itm/191196351985

I'm not sure if the Jaguar housings can accept standard D44 gears or any aftermarket components like lockers.

Also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jaguar_independent_rear_suspension
« Last Edit: June 13, 2014, 01:41:09 PM by The Dark Side of Will »

Offline The Dark Side of Will

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #133 on: August 29, 2014, 01:16:39 PM »
The initial iteration of the bracket had the gussets welded on... but then got LOST (ie, accidentally thrown out by the cleaning lady  :-x  :-o )

So I had to build a new one. It's basically done except for blast/paint, but it will get a little more gusseting on the forward side.



So now that that's in it's final stages, I'm starting to build a Bill of Materials for overhauling the diff.

Offline The Dark Side of Will

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Re: Discussion of built driveline
« Reply #134 on: April 30, 2015, 05:56:43 PM »
Yeah after looking over my options I'm starting to think the best course of action is to rebuild my spare Dana 30, keep the 2.73 gearing for now, stuff a locker in it and then bolt it up. All the experimental stuff will have to wait until I get this thing running again.

Try www.car-parts.com and look for a 3.06 from a 258 Eagle with towing package... I understand not everyone wants 3.54's, especially if they're keeping automatics, but 2.73 is a pretty wimpy gear--just not as wimpy as 2.35!

 

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