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Author Topic: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info  (Read 3574 times)

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Offline TEagle85

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HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« on: August 25, 2015, 09:25:31 AM »
This is the next upgrade for under to hood.  I see there is plenty of info regarding the install, what can be removed after the install, and what has to stay etc.
I'm having a hard time finding info on the actual products bought, what one to get, and where to get it.

I'd like to get it within budget, not trying to spend more then $150 on everything if possible.

Seems the Skip White Performance HEI is the common simple choice. 
As of now I don't see anything on their site under the AMC/JEEP tab.     Wanted to go this route because I hear the gear is correct to the straight 6

If I got a different distributor is it easy enough to use my current stock gear and move it to the new unit? or are the mating surfaces proprietary?
Is there another distributor kit out there that is ready to go out of the box? Any links would be great.                                     
Looking for the easy direct answer of "click here and get this one" HAHA.  I've been getting confused with all the info about options out there.  :banghead:

I know I need new ignition wires. Is there a year and model used for reference just to avoid confusion when ordering? Saw somewhere on here that "Chevy Nova with an inline 6" worked.

Just trying to get more of a HEI reference together rather then the whole discussion and theory. 

Or if there is any links to a thread that has links or list info would be great. Sorry if this is a redundant post btw  :newbie: 

Thanks Everybody!
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 09:28:02 AM by TylerEagle »

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2015, 09:48:53 AM »
Ok so already on my way.
Found on here someone used a gear from a 85 Jeep 360.
Crown Automotive Sales Co.  Part #  J3208615
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CWA-J3208615

I see some saying only a AMC straight six gear will work and others saying a AMC V8 gear will work.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 09:50:44 AM by TylerEagle »

Offline eaglefreek

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2015, 10:08:59 AM »
I would give Skip White a call. I wonder why they don't list AMC distributors on their site anymore. I think most have just dropped the Skip White one right in without changing the gear without any issues.
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Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2015, 10:20:50 AM »
I have the Skip White in my SX/4.  Bought it off the eBay page.  It's been very reliable, but has too much advance built in.  I had to change the springs to the heaviest I could find to stop it from detonating under load.  It does appear to have a hardened gear, but I haven't heard of anyone with the 258 have any issues with it damaging the cam gear.  That was a big problem with the AMC V8 motors as the cam gear is a softer metal.  Good luck.
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2015, 11:10:57 AM »
Called them and they were saying they are more up to date on their Ebay page.
They said the gear will be fine but I heard a little bit of hesitation in her voice saying so. Probably nervous of liability? who knows.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/371058611629?_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
Skip White AMC JEEP 232 258 4.0 4.2 6 CYL HEI DISTRIBUTOR 6511-R

Ill double check the gear before install. But all I need now is new plug wires and to re gap the plugs?

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2015, 11:12:56 AM »
I had to change the springs to the heaviest I could find to stop it from detonating under load.


Think I should do this before install or just wait to see how it runs? Anyone else have this issue?

Thanks again
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 11:15:20 AM by TylerEagle »

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2015, 11:43:58 AM »
I just responded to someone on here today that's having that issue.  You can try it out.  It's not common, or most don't notice it, or care perhaps.  It drove me nuts.

Actually, I was going to buy a second one for my wagon and I called with a question.  They told me not to install it unless I had a matching, new cam gear to go in with it.  Kind of odd, as the gear is part of the cam on a 258.  I think she's referring to the V8 AMC engines.  There were metal hardness problems on a handful of brands of HEIs which caused the cam gear to get chewed up and destroyed.  Now they warn about it.  Never heard of an Eagle owner having an issue with this HEI and a 258 though.  I just know mine pinged no matter where I had initial timing set (vac disconnected) and the only way I could fix it and get initial where I wanted it was to install heavier springs from the MSD 8464 kit.  I used the heaviest.  I was then able to bring my initial back to where it should be, 9* BTDC and re-connect my vac advance without pinging issues.  I'm using ported for vac advance, as the ECM Test suggests.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 11:46:00 AM by macdude443 »
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2015, 03:37:07 PM »
Awesome Thanks!  I will post a few pictures once I get it in the mail (should be here in 2 days) . Ill show a side by side of the old and the new gear on the Distributer just to see if someone else sees something that I dont.

Now onto researching some plug wires and what else I can rip out from under the hood after the swap.
Every time I get to take more stuff out from under there the happier I get.

Offline eaglefreek

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2015, 06:51:11 PM »
The difference between the gears is the hardness and not something you can see. You need specialized equipment to check that.
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Online vangremlin

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2015, 07:05:20 PM »
I went with this one from CRT Performance and its worked really well.  Much better than dealing with the ignition control modules in the factory set up which seemed to be failing every couple months.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Jeep-AMC-GM-HEI-Distributor-Plug-wires-CJ5-CJ7-YJ-258-CRT-PERFORMANCE-/231663709338?hash=item35f03bac9a
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2015, 08:18:13 PM »
The difference between the gears is the hardness and not something you can see. You need specialized equipment to check that.

I got ya. Wasn't sure what level of difference there is of hardness between the two. Sometimes from the finish and wear, materials can be identified, but its not like one gear is plastic and one is metal I suppose. A little more dialed in then that. I trust from everything on here I will be fine. If not I'll find out down the road.  I'll keep this up to date with my install this weekend. Looks to be easy enough (knock on wood).

Also one more question, this HEI install seems to render the ECM test bypass I did earlier in the year pointless regarding the ignition system. That correct?
I know the ECM takes info from the sensors and applies it to the old carb. (Ive got a MC2150 on now)
Or does the HEI swap just render the ICM useless alone?
And the ECM test bypass is to just get rid of all the emission senors?

Thats actually 3 questions.
4 after this one:

Where is the best place to pull 12v from for the new Distributer, Old Coil wire, or is there a better spot people tap into?

Just curious more then anything about all of the above.

Offline eaglefreek

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2015, 09:02:28 PM »
Since you have the ECM bypassed and have the MC2150 anyways, you can pull the ECM and all it's wiring. Also the ICM will not be used and kicked to the curb. Just make sure your 12v source is 12v when both in start and run position. There is a resistor wire in the coil wiring that gives less than 12v when in the run position.
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Offline Amc1320

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #12 on: August 26, 2015, 12:11:53 AM »
I have two of the skip white units, no problems with either one.

The cam gear issue is a big deal with the amc v8's not the sixes to my knowledge

Yes the whole other ignition is now useless, you can pull it all off, and the coil too of course.

I ran the hot wire to the solenoid to the 12v key on post on top. The hei needs a full 12 v all the time, both start immediately and run great

Rob c
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Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #13 on: August 26, 2015, 10:51:55 AM »
According to a guru on the JeepForum site, you can test the hardness of the gear by attempting to drill a hole in the skirt of the gear, 90* to the roll pin.  If it drills easily, you're cool.  If it barely scratches it, it'll most certainly chew a V8 cam gear.  Probably wouldn't be great for a 6 either but shouldn't cause as much damage.  Some of the cheapies had improper tooth pitch and the hardnened ones were sometimes poorly machined, with hard metal and almost serrated teeth.  They were like a milling machine, lol.
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2015, 11:20:55 AM »
Thanks for all the input. Ill have to give the drill test a shot and try to be as noninvasive as possible. Results posted tomorrow.

Just picked up these plug wires.

http://www.autozone.com/ignition/wireset-performance/accel-wireset-performance/133157_562028_2268/

searched under 1969 Chevrolet Nova 4.1L 1BL OHV 6cyl.

I plan to use the same plugs since there they are pretty new. Just basics if I remember right. I will just gap them to around .45 if I read correct.

Also picked up the MSD Advance Kit 8464 just in case.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2015, 11:23:44 AM by TylerEagle »

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2015, 11:58:04 AM »
I think you're on your way.  I bought plug wires for a '79 Ford with an inline 6, if remember right.  You want 8mm plug wires and a .045 gap.
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #16 on: August 26, 2015, 12:05:42 PM »
yep 8mm.    .045 not .45 got it. that could have been a problem.

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2015, 12:58:45 PM »
.45 is almost half an inch, lol. You would have figured something was up.
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #18 on: August 29, 2015, 12:40:19 PM »
I should add that my HEI Dist. did not come with the connector to hook up the 12v and the tach wire.
I ended up grabbing this one.

ACCEL HEI Pigtail
Part # 170072   SKU: 9960600

http://www.pepboys.com/product/details/9960600/00856

Offline carnuck

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2015, 11:48:28 PM »
2 issues I've seen/run into. The gear gets messed up because the cam in the 4.2L walks (cam button cures that) or high volume oil pump isn't cut deep enough and the dist shaft is rammed down, binding the oil pump. Aside from that, only AMC V8s have been having the problems. Motorcraft gear on Chevy dist eats the cam gear due to wobble.
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Offline amcfool1

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #20 on: August 30, 2015, 04:33:04 AM »
hi, HEI distributors, what to do...well, you have two choices, buy the discounted Ebay/amazon/4wdr cheapies, and then sweat the tuning, or maybe even break your motor. or pay real money for the DUI, about 6 times the ebay cheapies I have one of each, and, I will NEVER buy one of those cheapies again. Just cheap Chinese junk, the advance is all wrong,about 50+ degrees, ok you can fix that, after buying an advance kit, maybe an adjustable can too, another $50. or so. Not such a bargain anymore.This is a stark example of "you get what you pay for", a real DUI is about $300., a Skip White, or other ebay brand is about $55-95.. Absolute junk. don't go there, unless you are one of the few people that have the time and knowledge to completely recurve that distributor and pay extra for that kit, about $40. from Crane. I bought one of the first DUI distributors for the AMC 6 way back in 99, had a small problem with it, not seating all the way, sent it back, they fixed it, put it in the car, set timing, and then basically forgot about it for 15 years, and way over 100k miles in Eagle#1 The car is off the road now, terminal rust, but the DUI is just fine, it outlived the car. i pulled the dist. out, still good, but REALLY dirty, cleaned it a little, sent it back to DUI for a cleaning/test/ lube. etc. that cost about $100., including shipping there and back. this is now a 16 year old distributor, and looks and works like new money! Again, you get what you pay for, it seemed strange to me, why pay $300. for something you can get for $59.99, well I am here to tell you, pay the $300, night and day difference between the DUI and the online "knockoffs". they are junk, and junk, and more junk! You have been warned, good luck, gz

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #21 on: August 30, 2015, 10:07:06 PM »
I hear you, I figure this is too cheap and good to be true but unfortunately I dont have that to spend at the moment and I already pulled the trigger on all the parts. Actually installed it all today. installation was very smooth and easy. I dont think I took as much care to marking the positions of the rotor or finding TDC. After I wired it all up it started right away but is running very rough. Like you said its a issue of dialing it in. I will soon find out or learn if Im getting in over my head tuning this thing. My goal was to get it running today. Started up, moved the cap around seeing if timing was within range and it was not.  I shut the car off and locked up. Ill have more time to mess with it tomorrow, if it comes down to it Ill have a professional swing by.

According to a guru on the JeepForum site, you can test the hardness of the gear by attempting to drill a hole in the skirt of the gear, 90* to the roll pin.  If it drills easily, you're cool.  If it barely scratches it, it'll most certainly chew a V8 cam gear.


For experimental reasons I tried this. New gear did seem a  little tougher to make a mark in. you can see some marks from the bit slipping and on the old one a tiny dot where the drill bit settled.
IMG_4391 by Tyler Avery, on Flickr

If anything it looks really nice in there, just cant wait to get it running smooth so I can start going to town on all those wires!

IMG_4397 by Tyler Avery, on Flickr

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #22 on: August 31, 2015, 09:52:33 AM »
It's funny.  I agree with the more expensive options listed above.  How do you take something that expensive and reduce it to $59.99?  Yesterday I pulled my eBay HEI out and put the Motorcraft unit in.  A lot of the wiring was cut and removed, so I used the schematic and new/used parts to re-create it.  When I pulled the HEI I immediately noticed some wear on the camshaft gear.  That didn't feel good.  Hopefully it wasn't too bad.  I know most haven't had issues with their cheapie HEI units, but I don't want to continue using it.  I don't even drive this car that often.
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #23 on: August 31, 2015, 10:25:44 AM »
 
How do you take something that expensive and reduce it to $59.99?

Ha or how do you take something that affordable and charge $300?    Well :censored:, I'm going to mess with it a little more today and see where I get. Seems the attitude has changed towards the Skip White HEI. To avoid any potential problems in the future I will consider just going back to stock and forgetting the whole thing. Maybe go about it a different way.

Any links to the DUI or the motocraft? Id like to check them out. See the actual differences, place of manufacture and who re brands them/distributes them. A lot of bullshit out there. Both on the cheap and expensive side.

My end game is less clutter and if it runs 5% better then stock Im happy. Still nervous about the gear but those can be removed and changed. Ill measure it out but I probably could move the original onto the new one?
« Last Edit: August 31, 2015, 10:29:40 AM by TEagle85 »

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #24 on: August 31, 2015, 11:26:10 AM »
Found this one.
http://www.4wheelparts.com/Performance-Parts/D-U-I-Distributor.aspx?t_c=74&t_s=43&t_pt=3825&t_pn=P/D40620&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=shopping&emlprox=out&ppcfon=1&gp=1&gclid=Cj0KEQjw9o-vBRCO0OLi2PfPkI8BEiQA8pdF4GQX43HtQIkM6hkoxQiWv9f4NTSiWLtM38jNaXbGxGgaAry98P8HAQ


 I know I could be insanely wrong but that looks (looks being the faulty word here) almost identical to the Skip white. I'm sure the coil is a lot better and you also get the assembly and expertise of the builder to pre set the curve at least closer then the Skip white. Is that essentially what you are paying for?   I can deal with a sub par coil for the moment and I can deal with the hope for a dialed in tune. Cant tell if they use a different gear or not. Anyone have any other input on differences in terms of construction? better bearings, material, etc.?  Wondering your experiences. Might try to justify it. I plan to do another trip this weekend so I will go back to stock for the mean time because I know that works.


Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #25 on: August 31, 2015, 01:23:07 PM »
I'm sure there are better materials in the pricier models.  How would you tell?  No idea.  There is a lot of BS out there on these items and I've heard pros and cons to all.  I'd say, add the springs to your SW unit, put it in and check for gear wear often.  I don't think the gear from your stock unit will fit on the SW dist, due to differences in shaft diameter, but you could try.

There are upgrades for the stock iginition.  Check out the Team Rush/Big Cap Upgrade.  A lot of Jeep sites will show the process.  You're basically replacing the stock cap with a larger cap and the rotor with a taller rotor.  This moves the spark energy away from the base and spreads out the terminals.  It prevents crossfire.  You can then up the spark energy by upgrading the coil and plug wires.  A lot use the Blaster 2F coil (direct fit) and 8mm wires from a Ford (1979 Ford F-150 w/300 CID I6 Motor).  You'll need the new wires as the terminals on the new cap are different.  Any auto parts store can get those parts for you.  You'll also need the "cap adapter" to use the larger cap.  This was an upgrade for all Ford Duraspark ignitions, but it will not show up under AMC on the store computers.
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #26 on: August 31, 2015, 02:44:05 PM »
Thanks, ill keep this thread updated as I go.  Thats what I need to hear. "just go for it, keep an eye on it, you'll be ok" haha.

I'm originally an industrial designer so I notice re branded crap all the time. I assume some Chinese manufacture is busting out those Aluminum housings one after the other and those then are sold to the many "manufactures" of Distributors here in the U.S. They each add their outsourced caps and coils from wherever else, toss their sticker on and call it what they will.  Just some Chinese crap is assembled with more care then others. Obviously not the case all the time but most of the time.
So if the extra $250 spent towards the DUI setup will only save me a headache of tune-ability and there are others that have not had issues with the Ebay HEI Ill give it a shot. Just need to stock up on some aspirin and make sure I don't spend more then $250 on Aleve. Otherwise its not worth it anymore and Ill go the DUI route.

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #27 on: August 31, 2015, 02:55:58 PM »
There you go.  The two things you want to avoid with any distributor you go with is gear wear and detonation.  What you want is decent performance.  Is it really much to ask for? Haha.

Funny thing is, even the rebuilt distributors are a crap-shoot.  I bought a rebuild unit from a Jeep supplier and the springs didn't have the right pre-load.  It pinged and rattled.  Over the years, AMC/Jeep changed the advance heads in the distributors to allow for less and less centrifugal advance as the computer took over more and more of this electronically.  The rebuilds could come with an advance head from any old year.  The 70's era units allowed 13-18* degrees depending on which slot in the advance head was utilized.  Computer years (early-late 80's) have 6.75-7.75* slots.  Unless you know how to check, you could hobble your pre-computer car for advance by installing a distributor with computer-era internals.  (Easy to check, btw).  This is why I always accept distributors when people pull them.  I have tons of parts to make anything I want work.  There are a lot of options with that stock distributor.
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #28 on: August 31, 2015, 03:01:14 PM »
Thanks again, you guys rule. Thumbs up to Macdude for comforting me in a time of stress HAHA.

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #29 on: August 31, 2015, 03:09:35 PM »
Haha, thanks.  Most ignition work seems to be a "time of stress" for me.  :o
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Offline carnuck

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #30 on: August 31, 2015, 05:19:23 PM »
I would try running it temporarily without the vacuum advance (once the motor is warmed up) Since it's not stock, you'll need to set timing by ear or with a vacuum gauge. I advance till the stutter goes away. The MC carb prefers high vacuum for good function, which is why they don't work well with most high performance cams unless you put a very low number powervalve in. (The lower the number, the lower the vacuum has to drop for it to open. If it opens too soon, the carb floods and runs like kaka)

I would change the dist gear to a softer one from another source if you're worried about it. If you change the module and pickup coil in the Skip White unit, you get the same thing you pay $300 for unless you're worried about the mechanical advance.

The spring and weight kit is only $5-$20 and very simple to do. You don't even have to pull the dist unless you're a fumble fingers.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sum-g5212?seid=srese1&gclid=Cj0KEQjw9o-vBRCO0OLi2PfPkI8BEiQA8pdF4Ddm-THPWVRT9Aw1m3EPge8fgRYSu9U79kKkqYOYbeQaAi7t8P8HAQ
« Last Edit: August 31, 2015, 05:49:27 PM by carnuck »
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Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #31 on: August 31, 2015, 09:38:48 PM »
Haha holy crap do I feel like a moron. I was so quick out the door of my garage I mixed up the 4 and 5 spark plug wires. Which is why it ran like :censored:. Duh.
I got there today and after staring under the hood for 30 seconds I saw my sharpie numbers on the cap did not match the plug. Swapped them around and runs like a champ. So quick to spell disaster haha.

Took it for a drive and everything seemed fine. I still need to dial in the timing and properly tune the carb. I did start pulling a lot of the wires out. So far so good but I'm at the point of figuring out exactly what has to stay as far as wires go.

So that's it, threads closed haha

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #32 on: September 03, 2015, 07:00:37 PM »
So far so good.
The only thing that is throwing me off is I'm pretty sure the harmonic balancer is off.   I set initial timing around 9* with the vacuum advance plugged. Put in the heavy springs and all seemed well on the timing light through all the RPM range, thought I had it all figured out.
Took it for a drive and as soon as I try to accelerate the motor just bogs right down. Went back to the garage and adjusted the timing by ear this time with vac advance on and runs a lot better. Been driving it around all day. But now on my balancer its showing initial timing at like 20*   

timing dips (retards) for moment before advancing when I rev the motor. Saw this is common with some others on some jeep forums.

also I noticed when the vacuum advance is hooked up it curves the timing, even at idle. I tried turning the diaphragm both ways with the supplied Allen key.   You guys remember what way you turned it to lessen its pull?   

For now it runs well and goes through all the gears. Also after adjusting the carb it runs better then ever. Just picked up a Vacuum gauge/tester.  heading on a 500mile road trip on Saturday so I will bring all the tools and gauges with me. As long as it runs solid at 2000rpm at 65mph Im happy. Also plan to get some time on the trails up there. Ill post some pictures on my Project thread or one of the others.

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #33 on: September 04, 2015, 09:16:46 AM »
The slight retard in advance could be the weights unseating.  I set my vacuum advance canister so it began to add advance at about 5" of vacuum, using a hand pump and gauge.  You want it all out when the engine is under load, which is a low/no vacuum situation.  Ideally it should be all-in a 2-3" below max vacuum available with no load, but I doubt most adjustments will allow for it.  I just makes sure it's all taken out under load.
1982 Eagle SX/4
1986 Eagle Wagon

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #34 on: September 04, 2015, 10:10:00 PM »
my vacuum port on the carb (ported vac) pulls about 15" at idle with the vacuum advance starting around 5"-8" so Im assuming its always advanced? I turned the allen key counter clockwise so it takes more vac to open.

also never happened to me before but I drove to the auto store to grab the vacuum tester walked out and out of the blue the car would barely start, when it did it sputtered and black smoke started coming out of the exhaust tip. I thought that was the end of the motor. Turned the dist in the parking lot didn't help. heard noise from the carb and smelled gas. Took the filter off and there was a pool of boiling gas in the carb.  Screwed in both mixture screws on the Motocraft then backed both out 2 1/2 turns. Started running fine. Made me nervous.  It was 85 deg today guessing that had something to do with it.

little by little.  Leave tomorrow, I have the car packed with tools, hopefully everything is fine.

Offline amcfool1

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #35 on: September 05, 2015, 01:03:11 AM »
you're a brave man heading out on a long trip with a not quite sorted out car. good luck to you, I mean that! But...this is what your $300. gets you, peace of mind. My DUI, (Davis Unified Ignition, Memphis, TN} ran from day one for over 15 years, I didn't even change the cap and rotor!, and is still good to go on the next car I put it in. Now it has a new brass terminal cap/rotor. O f course it looks just like the "knockoffs", an HEI is  an HEI!, they ALL look the same!, and, with DUI, if you have a problem, there is a place to send it back to, with real live people to talk to, who at least pretend to appreciate your business. I don't know all the differences, but I think they start with better cores, maybe even GM sourced. I've heard stories on some Jeep forums, about the cheapies, about the shafts breaking, bearings going bad within MONTHS, aluminum flaking off, falling into engine, etc, etc. Now, I can't substantiate those stories, all i have to tell you is my personal experience. If it seems too good to be true, it probably is. Your Eagle is a great car, good luck with it. gz

Offline Billman

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #36 on: September 05, 2015, 06:40:14 PM »
Now you guys are making me nervous. I dropped in a Skip White and set it up with a tach, vacuum gauge and timing light. After minor fine tuning and fiddling the car has run fine for about a year.Now I see that there are other people having issues this makes me wonder if I should pull it back out and check the gear and whats all this about setting vac advance and different weights and springs? The more I read the more  I find out how little I know. I have plans to put a complete 4.0 drive train  in this particular car from a '95 Cherokee soon so if this dizzy eats my motor I'll just have to do it sooner.
1982 SX/4
1983 SX/4
1983 wagonProject
1984 wagon DD
1996 Jeep
2007  Caliber
2004 Silverado

Offline Amc1320

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #37 on: September 05, 2015, 08:45:07 PM »
Ported vaccum should read nothing at idle and increase when you open the throttle

Manifold vacuum should read 18-20 at idle and decrease when the throttle is opened
Rob c
84 Eagle Limited Wagon (driven everyday)
81 Eagle Kammback
81 Spirit (undergoing surgery)
83 Spirit (parts car giving it all to keep the rest going)
Manchester, TN

Offline amcfool1

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #38 on: September 06, 2015, 03:57:14 AM »
hi, if your car has been running ok for over a year with the SW cheapie, you are probably ok. Sometimes they get it right. sometimes they don't. You got lucky. Enjoy! gz

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #39 on: September 12, 2015, 04:06:50 PM »
So all is good, drives great. Starts up better then ever, Although sometimes when the starter motor turns the engine initially if has trouble like its battling extreme compression. like one of the cylinders is holding pressure when I turn the car off.  other then that its good.  I will probably invest in a DUI at some point but this will hold me over just fine.   

Offline TEagle85

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #40 on: September 22, 2015, 01:07:33 PM »
Back for another update.  So I ended up getting a D.U.I. dist.  most of the parts seem the same as the skip white (same casting marks and markings), The gear seems identical. When I pulled the skip white out the gear looked brand new after a few hundred miles. The finish was not even touched so I think we can all rest on the worries of the skip white gear, I cant say that after 10,000 miles but at that rate I have to imagine its perfectly fine.

The electronics are the obvious upgrades to this unit plus the tuning done by professionals for that exact motor is also a huge plus. However this swap didn't solve any of my problems really and I'm back to trying to dial it in as if the skip white was still in there. Was hoping it would be a drop in success.

Took it for a hour drive yesterday.  here are a couple of my issues if anyone has any input.

-My ported vac nipple on the carb pulls almost 5in at idle and jumps quickly to 20in when I give the engine some gas. worried that it is advancing the vacuum advance too soon.
-Engine bogs down like crazy during a hard accel. it kind of goes away when I advance the engine but then that causes too much advance on the highway and some pinging occurs.
-Related to the bogging down is the timing (i think) when I watch the timing marks on the harmonic balancer the engine retards a moment then runs its advance curve when I hit the throttle. I think its when that timing retards it causes the engine to bog.  Carb issue? Dist. issue? valve or motor issue?

I tried hooking it up to manifold just to see what would happen and not much of a difference. Still bogged down some and it also bogs down when the vac advance is plugged.
At this point I'm convinced its the motocraft carb that needs adjusting or something with the throttle linkage. The bogged acceleration is driving me nuts  :banghead:

Offline macdude443

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #41 on: September 22, 2015, 02:35:43 PM »
I had the same problem with my motorcraft, though it wasn't as pronounced.  If I stepped on it, it'd bog and then quickly recover.  One reason I don't recommend it.  Could have been my unit.

As far as ported vac.  If you are getting any ported vac at idle, then your throttle plates are too far open/curb idle is set slightly too high.  Hook a vac gauge up to ported and slowly back off the curb idle until the vacuum drops to zero.  Then try to get your idle speed back up (if too low) by adjusting mixture screws.  Yes, I'm aware the idle mixture screws are not meant for idle speed, but this may be necessary to tweak it a little and get to the RPMs you want at idle.  Keep in mind, when the car is on fast idle, the throttle plates are opened up more by design, so make the adjustment when the choke is fully open and the engine is at normal operating temperature.  This is what I do with the Carter.  The principle should be the same with the 2100/2150.

In regards to the gear.  You may not have a problem.  Did you check the distributor gear or the camshaft drive gear?  The camshaft gear is the one that will wear if there's a problem with hardness.  (Not really a gear, as it's a permanent part of the cam on the 258).
« Last Edit: September 22, 2015, 02:37:23 PM by macdude443 »
1982 Eagle SX/4
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Offline el-camino

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Re: HEI UPGRADE Links and Info
« Reply #42 on: September 22, 2015, 04:42:06 PM »
its very simple, remove the old distributor and the stock carb, buy a HEI and a Weber and have fun ;)
one great thing more, after this you can clean up with the vacuum hoses.
i think i have only 3 hoses now


this video was before i cleaned up the vacuum lines  :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdkr9V5bfoE

very important with the Weber is the fuel pressure
my distributor is not the most expensive but round about 120$

take a look on your timing chain, the most are a little bit too long after the years, and there will not help a new carburetor and distributor ;)

one more video, before paintjob and with cleaned vacuum hoses
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTOHxGYTwmA
« Last Edit: September 22, 2015, 06:10:49 PM by el-camino »
greets from Sweden
Klaus

www.forneby-hill.com

 

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