'84 Eagle Limited FULL resto

[BaldEagle]

Hello everyone:
   I just bought an '84 Eagle Limited, 4-dr wagon with the 6cyl automatic! I've never owned  before, so have much to learn, but this car looks to be a cream-puff, body wise. No dents, decent paint, and most importantly..............very little surface rust on the underside. Interior needs the most work: torn seats, sagging headliner, missing knobs, and few mold spots. It doesn't currently run, but the PO is a friend that was using it for a daily driver before parking it due to intermittent starting issues. I have a couple of questions to start: With the battery fully charged and clean terminals, I get clicking from the solenoid and no start. Tried bypassing it, using the search here and the pliers trick, to no avail. Even having a NSS, a bypass should point to the starter, if I'm correct? I've yet to check all grounds, and clean all connections, so there is still hope there! My other Q is about cleaning up the mold inside. I've always used a bleach-water mix to clean and kill mold in the past.............but never on a vehicle. Will bleach be harmful, say in the hot sun, or is there anything else I can use that truly KILLS? Here are the only crummy cell phone pics I currently have.









I'm so stoked about this car!!! 

[Prafeston]

Look forward to the updates!

[Whuntmore]

I'll be watching this topic as well. 

btw, if you're looking for info on how to do this or that, or possible parts numbers, or maybe even substitutes, then check over other people's Project cars.

They might have gotten into the same problems you're about to (fixing, replacing, modding, or upgrading) and they've gone thru the headaches.

For example:

Priya has like 37 pages on her car project,
Juhap has like 25,
thereverendbill - 23
Mavericke - 19,
Whuntmore (that's me) 18,
and
Trapperjack has 11 pages

There's also our Eaglepedia with the section on 'How To' and if you're stuck, just ask.

[BaldEagle]

Thanks, guys. I will have to look through the other build threads as I have time. I think that will be especially helpful for mods and ideas for the build. Have already searched and found some great repair tips on the starting system, which I will at least start on today. Say, in searching around on that topic, I thought that I'd seen an upgrade for the starter........but of course can't find it now. Any ideas?

[Baskinator]

Nice! Welcome to the Eagle project world lol. The post on the bottom of the Auto solenoid is the ground. You can install a manual solenoid, which is cheaper, and just leave that wire hanging. It will work the same, but bypass the NSS. You can leave it like this permanently, or just do that to test it without spending as much. Either way, these solenoids are apparently pretty fickle. If you get one from Advance Auto, I'm sure you could take it right back after testing no questions.

You might also want to examine the fuel system, all lines leading up to it, and spray in some carb cleaner. The stock Carter BBD is known for having clogged jets.

Your AMC, since it has the 258, is highly compatible with many Jeep parts, so availability for most things mechanical should not be a problem. To save you some ID time, your model will generally have the AMC 4.2l 258 w/plastic valve cover, Carter BBD carburetor, Torqueflite 998 Transmission, NP129 Transfer Case, Dana 35 rear axle, and Dana 30 front axle. Common upgrades are Motorcraft 2150 carb, 4.0l cylinder head swap, and a high energy ignition, but you should probably solve the starting issues first. Not sure yet what other options there are for a starter, some other people around here might know.

[BaldEagle]

Thanks for the info! It does have the plastic valve cover, which is probably why the engine is so covered in grease...........that's gotta go SOON. But of course, the starting issue is first on the list. Weather is miserable here today, so I only took the time to clean/tighten the ground to block, and check the positive cable and starter for looseness. I really suspect the starter since the bypass didn't work, but have an auto style solenoid avail nearby for just $16. Generally, I like to do the cheapest and easiest fixes first when troubleshooting anyway, it's just that failed bypass test has me concerned. I haven't started or driven the car yet, so I will be  until this issue's fixed!

[mr.mindless]

If crossing the posts on the solenoid didn't make it crank, I wouldn't spend any time on that at all. You've got a starter issue or a starter ground issue.  Time to get out the jumper cables and go straight to the starter and confirm it's good.

[Baskinator]

The starter is actually very simple to remove. Just 2 bolts hold it to the bellhousing, and 2 long screws hold it together. Once you take it out, you can inspect the brushes/armature/coil/drive gear and clean it out thoroughly, as well as grease the drive gear. Brushes are a couple dollars, new starter is ~$60. But I agree, make sure the cables are working well and your battery is good.

[BaldEagle]

I think I will go straight to the starter, regardless of having the solenoid now. At least it's on hand, if needed, and I'll prob replace it anyway given it's age. It's good to know that the starter is such an easy replacement and rebuild, and access seemed pretty good when I was checking for looseness. +1 for my Subaru, though.............the starter's on top of the tranny with easy access. 
It's pretty hard to beat the ease of it, mechanically. No more work today, until this friggin blizzard passes!

Here's my intro thread, for more info:
http://forums.amceaglenest.com/index.php?topic=38135.0

[doc65]

Just to throw this out there on mine the NSS feed ground to the activation coil on the solenoid, and my NSS is malfunctioning, so even it you short power to the positive side of the sol it won't even click.  I got a pigtail for like $1.50 from one of the auto houses(push-on style) and the put the other end of that wire under the screw of one of the relays next to the sol.  after that it starts great either with the key or by hitting the solenoid with pliars or what ever(so long as the key is in run that is)

Just throwing out there that BOTH the Pos & Neg side of the activation coil are switched, Pos by key in start position, and Neg by NSS

Doc

[BaldEagle]

Just to throw this out there on mine the NSS feed ground to the activation coil on the solenoid, and my NSS is malfunctioning, so even it you short power to the positive side of the sol it won't even click.  I got a pigtail for like $1.50 from one of the auto houses(push-on style) and the put the other end of that wire under the screw of one of the relays next to the sol.  after that it starts great either with the key or by hitting the solenoid with pliars or what ever(so long as the key is in run that is)

Just throwing out there that BOTH the Pos & Neg side of the activation coil are switched, Pos by key in start position, and Neg by NSS

Doc

Awesome info, Doc! I suspected the NSS, even though I tried pushing on the gearshift while cranking, and in neutral. The bypass just didn't seem to do anything at all, and I would expect at least a groan from the starter. I'll try grounding the NSS connection before anything else. I'll keep you all up to date, once the weather clears up. I'm not anxious, but more curious now about what will fix it.

[doc65]

The NSS/Neg side of the solenoid is easy to miss, it's a small stud on the bottom of the solenoid that kinda points at the inner fender-well by the way...

Doc

[doc65]

Oh, and by the way, I wiggled the heck out of my shifter & moved it all over the place with not effect, I finally decided that since I'm the only one that'll drive it in the near future I'd worry about that(the NSS) later after a long list of nit-picky details are resolved.

[BaldEagle]

Oh, and by the way, I wiggled the heck out of my shifter & moved it all over the place with not effect, I finally decided that since I'm the only one that'll drive it in the near future I'd worry about that(the NSS) later after a long list of nit-picky details are resolved.

That's my view of it, as well. I'm not going to jimmy-rig anything on this car.................permanently. The solenoid I bought is the correct one for an auto, which will be good if I need to replace the NSS in the future, but for the time being I'll just ground it to see if that's the problem. I mean, heck...........I haven't even heard it run yet!!! The moldy french fries on the rear floorboards would take priority over the NSS, for me. 

[Baskinator]

The manual solenoid is exactly the same as the auto one, except without the bottom (ground) post and it's about $15 cheaper. Doesn't require any mods, the old wire just hangs unconnected and the NSS is completely bypassed. All this means is that it can start in any gear, but it's not really a problem and won't cause anything bad to happen (so long as you have your foot on the brake if mistakenly in Drive). If your ground wire isn't working for some reason, the manual one I believe grounds directly to the body, therefore eliminating the whole NSS circuit.

I didn't quite like the idea at first either because technically the NSS is required to work for PA inspection, but it got my car to start and saved me money when I needed to replace mine.

[eagleman]

Good luck and can't wait to see the outcome.

[BaldEagle]

The manual solenoid is exactly the same as the auto one, except without the bottom (ground) post and it's about $15 cheaper. Doesn't require any mods, the old wire just hangs unconnected and the NSS is completely bypassed. All this means is that it can start in any gear, but it's not really a problem and won't cause anything bad to happen (so long as you have your foot on the brake if mistakenly in Drive). If your ground wire isn't working for some reason, the manual one I believe grounds directly to the body, therefore eliminating the whole NSS circuit.

I didn't quite like the idea at first either because technically the NSS is required to work for PA inspection, but it got my car to start and saved me money when I needed to replace mine.

I would have gone that route too, with that kind of price difference, but Orielly's had the auto one for only like a buck or two more. I installed the solenoid today, and tried grounding the bottom stud, but it didn't do the trick. At least it has a very nice clicking noise now! Time to head to the starter.....I think I'd rather rebuild it myself, as I've not been impressed with rebuilt starters in the past.

[Baskinator]

I may have exaggerated on the price of the auto solenoid, couldn't remember exactly what it was, but it's about $10 difference on Rockauto.com. If you act quickly, they have a reman starter for sale for $25, only one in stock. That's less than the price of the drive gear if it's busted, and I'd even get it to replace mine if I had the money.

If you choose the rebuild route however, it's not too difficult. Two of the brushes can simply be screwed out and new ones put in, but one will require soldering. Just get it real clean in there, and grease the drive gear. If the gear is broken, I would suggest just buying a new/reman starter as the replacement gear is more than half the price (and just as expensive as that starter on Rockauto right now).

[BaldEagle]

I may have exaggerated on the price of the auto solenoid, couldn't remember exactly what it was, but it's about $10 difference on Rockauto.com. If you act quickly, they have a reman starter for sale for $25, only one in stock. That's less than the price of the drive gear if it's busted, and I'd even get it to replace mine if I had the money.

If you choose the rebuild route however, it's not too difficult. Two of the brushes can simply be screwed out and new ones put in, but one will require soldering. Just get it real clean in there, and grease the drive gear. If the gear is broken, I would suggest just buying a new/reman starter as the replacement gear is more than half the price (and just as expensive as that starter on Rockauto right now).

Nah, most parts stores do have a $10-15 difference, but Oreilly's has the best deal I could find at $16 for the auto type. I'll test the starter first with some jumper cables, just to see if it's a power/ground issue, then go from there. That is an awesome deal for a starter...........even with S&H, it's about $8 less than the parts stores. Given the probs I've had in the past with rebuilt starters though, I'd pay that $8 just for a lifetime warranty. If it's anything more than brushes, that will be the route I go. The new solenoid does have a real nice sounding click to it now! 

[BaldEagle]

For those who didn't see my starter thread, the car's running now. It was a dead cell in the battery, ultimately. It fired right up, with only 1/4 tank of year old gas in it. Since then I've fixed horrible vacuum leaks, replaced belts, cleaned inside and out, and filled the tank with a Seafoam treatment. It runs pretty good, but does kind of sputter or pop at idle. I think it's running lean.............which may explain why my MPG calculation was such a shock. 31mpg over 95 miles, with hwy and city driving!!! Really, I haven't done anything to it that would be considered an upgrade, and it's sat for a year at 177K miles. I'm almost afraid to try and make it run smooth because of a big drop in mileage. 
I wouldn't mind a drop of a couple mpg's to have it run better, so maybe my next step will be some reversible work. The computer bypass test seems like a good candidate, and cleaning up the vacuum lines can only help, I believe. If I can keep the mileage up there with some upgrades, like the TFI ignition, and have it run good.............I think this will be my main focus on this project. I want the car to look relatively stock, but performance and functionality will be first!
~E

[BaldEagle]

   Well, I did some steps in doing the ECM Test, but didn't have vacuum hose or a tee to make it permanent. Even with just the stepper motor pins fully extended and unplugged, the car runs great now EXCEPT during fast idle. Then it fires right up with just one pump of the skinny pedal, but pops sporadically. When timing, I had it running smooth as glass, but having to plug the vacuum back in destroyed that. Also the timing mark was a little jumpy..............what does that symptom point to? I still highly doubt the calculated 31mpg's that I got last time, so I'll re-figure that now that it's running better.
   New parts from the JY today!!! I've got a really clean MC2150 to rebuild, and a pass side door handle. 
I've got to get my DSLR out and charged for some decent pics soon, but here's another crummy cell one. Egr base is gone now.



Exciting project............I love this car!!!

[GRONK]

By the looks of it, you have a 77-79'ish 2150.  If it's a 1.08 you are good to go.

Looking at your throttle linkage, you will need to grind off that throttle linkage ball and make your own drop linkage.  This is very simple.

If you need anything, let me know.

[BaldEagle]

Thanks Gronk, I'll likely be needing your carbless kit soon. How much does that go for, and does it include the air housing?

[doc65]

Air housing???

[BaldEagle]

Yeah, that was a little vague............air filter housing. 

[shanebo]

I'll chime in as a satisfied customer...gronks set up is awesome! It sure put a lot of pep back into my old bird, not to mention it gets rid of a lot of those darn vaccum lines.

[BaldEagle]

I'll chime in as a satisfied customer...gronks set up is awesome! It sure put a lot of pep back into my old bird, not to mention it gets rid of a lot of those darn vaccum lines.

   My rebuild won't be quite as good as his, but done with the same kit, adapter, etc...........it should still run a lot better than the BBL with stepper disconnected!

   After putting more miles on between fill-ups, it looks like the gas mileage is pretty average. 17-18mpg. I almost feel better about that mileage, over 30, because now I can make improvements to it without worry of decreasing mpg's.

   That sporadic timing mark could mean a worn distributor or timing chain?
Thanks,
~E

[BaldEagle]

Finally got an update for you guys. This weekend I'll be taking it camping and the weather looks promising for a photo shoot.
*Interior detailed by my wife and myself. No more mold, and the musty smell is long gone now. Sagging headliner removed. Rubbing alcohol works great for killing mold, dries quickly, and no harm to interior surfaces.
*Grill was plastic welded and put on.
*Nuttered, and it ran slightly better
*All vacuum lines replaced or deleted. This was the best improvement to date. No sputtering at any RPM, and smooth as glass! It's very basic for now, and the EGR is just capped temporarily.
*Hatch hinges replaced after breaking one. 
*Titled in my name, and new tags.
*Next up I have some RH door handles to put in, EGR to hook up, and TFI upgrade with tune up. The MC2150 rebuild is on hold until needed. Right now I can't even tell if it's running at stop signs, so I don't need to muck that up. This car is proving to be extremely reliable..........my wife has driven it to 90 miles round trip to work for a couple of months now without incident. I'm very grateful for the help this forum has provided us! I love the Eagle, and now must resist the temptation to buy the '87 for sale right down the highway. First one we've seen since getting ours, too. 
~E

[BaldEagle]

Sad, sad time for us..............
the Eagle was totaled over the weekend.
My wife was driving, but she was not at fault so we'll be shopping for a new Eagle when we get the insurance money. I just hope they don't try and lowball us because of the type of car! I don't have any pictures yet, and may not get the car back for parts because it's over 4hrs from home. The impact was driver's front corner to the same on a newer Expedition, so it's munched pretty bad.

[Prafeston]

That is really sad news! Hope you get a reasonably pay out on the total and good luck with your search for another.

[BaldEagle]

Thanks, I didn't see any for sale on here nearby, but there are a few around at least.

[maddog]

sorry too hear the bad news hope your wife and you are all right.

[BaldEagle]

Oh yeah........forgot to mention that there were no injuries!!! My wife is pretty sore, but she'll be okay.
I figured out that it would cost us about $350 to get the car back here just for parts. That's only $50 less than we paid for the whole thing, though that was an exceptional deal. We may be able to strip select parts before it's scrapped, I hope.

[Prafeston]

Where are you located? Jim has two pretty nice ones available in AR. Mine's also available in MO, but I'm asking a lot!

[BaldEagle]

Mt. Hood, Oregon. The local classifieds have some up in WA, but still quite some distance. My wife won't settle on anything else but an Eagle, so it's worth a drive if need be!

[BaldEagle]

My wife did get some pictures. I don't know if it's repairable or not, but looks to be beyond my skills.












Just makes me sick........we haven't even got the title in the mail yet!!!

[Prafeston]

Yeah, that is just straight up sad to see!

I know Maverick has done some repairs like what you'd need to do...but it would be a lot of work.

http://forums.amceaglenest.com/index.php?topic=24008.0

[maddog]

if you ask me just from looking at the pics i think it can be saved pretty easily, well as long as the subframe is still strait that is. if it ain't strait well it can still be saved it will just need alot more work.

[mr.mindless]

if you ask me just from looking at the pics i think it can be saved pretty easily, well as long as the subframe is still strait that is. if it ain't strait well it can still be saved it will just need alot more work.

exactly my thoughts.  It really looks pretty cosmetic as long as the frame horn is OK or nearly so.  Hood and maybe hinges, full fender, core support, bumper and brackets, lights & bucket, some trim...

[BaldEagle]

We'll see if the insurance company totals it or not...............I'll try and save it just so long as we get enough for a replacement car too.

[El Matador]

That actually looks like it could be saved.  The front tire doesn't appear off camber or anything, so there shouldn't be any mechanical damage other than the radiator.

Your best bet may be to just take the car back and walk away without a settlement.  The car should keep a clean title that way, and not be declared salvage.  I don't know what the law is like in Oregon, but here in Alberta, once a vehicle gets branded as salvage it's extremely difficult and expensive to get it back on the road.  Plus, that branded title makes future resale more difficult, if you ever wanted to sell it.

[priya]

I think with that amount of damage the sub-"frame" likely is bent.  If a person were to remove the fender, front valence, grill and so on it might not be too much to pay a shop to pull the sub-"frame" straight and then one could do the remainder of the restoration oneself.

[mr.mindless]

It's a nigh on 30 year old car, a salvage title would hardly effect value IMO.

Here in NY, there's a "salvage inspection" one must go through after rebuilding a totalled car before the title is transferable. As long as parts sources are documented, it's really a non-event.

[shaggimo]

  That sucks, but it's only sheetmetal.......It can be replaced, that said, yours looks fixable, even if the rail is pushed back a bit.

[BaldEagle]

I'm going to try and get it back to save it, even if totaled. They've paid for a rental car until a check is cut, but we'll need to make sure that my wife has reliable transportation first. She commutes over 90 miles a day, and our eagle was really up to the task!

[eagleman]

Well its not good but with the right parts I think it could be saved. My biggest concern is of course the sub frame all the rest is replaceable with enough time and parts.

[BaldEagle]

The insurance company did end up totaling it, and said there was a twist to the entire body so if I get it back it will just be for parts or maybe an offroad rig.

[Euphonical]

My wife did get some pictures. I don't know if it's repairable or not, but looks to be beyond my skills.



Just makes me sick........we haven't even got the title in the mail yet!!!

<sigh> I miss that car!

[dustybat13]

Just found your thread. I was so excited for your project and then so disappointed to see what happened. I hope you find another Eagle.

[rollguy]

The insurance company did end up totaling it, and said there was a twist to the entire body so if I get it back it will just be for parts or maybe an offroad rig.

Either way, I would buy it back.  There are plenty of folks here that can fix it.  The insurance co. will probably only charge $300 or less for it (scrap value).  The engine alone is worth that much!   I have bought back every vehicle that I or someone in my family has wrecked, and have made a BIG profit on selling the parts, or fixing the car myself.  It is worth every penny that you pay to get the car back......Rich

[Euphonical]

The insurance company did end up totaling it, and said there was a twist to the entire body so if I get it back it will just be for parts or maybe an offroad rig.

Either way, I would buy it back.  There are plenty of folks here that can fix it.  The insurance co. will probably only charge $300 or less for it (scrap value).  The engine alone is worth that much!   I have bought back every vehicle that I or someone in my family has wrecked, and have made a BIG profit on selling the parts, or fixing the car myself.  It is worth every penny that you pay to get the car back......Rich

We talked about getting the wagon back for weeks. The biggest problem was the location, I'm sure we would've kept it had it gotten wrecked closer to home. But towing it 200 miles since it was not driveable just didn't seem feasible <sigh>